Forum Topic

Some great news, at last.

I am positive that everyone will celebrate the news that the UK will rejoin the Erasmus scheme for students from 2027, six years after ending its participation as part of BrexitStudents in the UK will be able to spend a year in Europe as part of their degree courses without paying extra fees, and vice versa for Europeans. At long last, Labour have taken a bold, positive, life-changing step. Well done to all involved!

Gerry Boyce ● 3d32 Comments

Mr Ainsworth'"Openness and honesty in online fora obviously mean nothing to you even though it invalidates their purpose and curtails  serious debate."'You are correct that this opinion was badly expressed.My claim is based upon my reaction to Boycie's insouciance regarding  the fact that comments were posted in my name expressing views I do not hold, and that he even saw the issue a cause for humour. I see the Forum as a platform for open and honest debate and if illegitimate doubt can be placed on posts by 'scammers' or call them what you will then the facility is worthless and hence debate curtailed.I hope that is made clearer for you.

John Hawkes ● 1d

"Openness and honesty in online fora obviously mean nothing to you even though it invalidates their purpose and curtails  serious debate."Que?

David Ainsworth ● 2d

Exactly that, at least according to Boris who insisted that the UK could remain part of Erasmus: “There is no threat to the Erasmus scheme; we will continue to participate.” By December 2020 the UK had dropped Erasmus membership from its post-Brexit deal with the EU, with Johnson claiming the UK “loses out” financially because of the larger number of EU nationals coming for university study. Of course, students at Northern Ireland’s universities have continued to participate with support of the Irish government.

Gerry Boyce ● 2d

It's great to hear, John, that you are getting to the bottom of it.

Gerry Boyce ● 2d

Boycie'Don't worry about it, John. It's clearly beyond your blinkered little frame of reference.You'd be better off investigating who hacked into your log on details; I still owe them a pint.'I assume it is within your frame of reference so why don't you provide the rest of us with your reasoning as to why Erasmus is important as a programme and student student studies could not be left to a contract between student and university.After all, £570 million is not peanuts so what it adds to student exchange needs to be understood.Will you do that ?And I am glad you find it amusing that people on this Forum can have their ids hacked and rather distasteful comments posted in their name.Can I assume you were not the hacker ?I personally do not think that for one moment regular Forum readers would have thought such comments sprang from me.The Forum moderator is investigating so as they say in cop shows "it will go better for you if your cough up now rather than drag out a process that might incriminate you later".Openness and honesty in online fora obviously mean nothing to you even though it invalidates their purpose and curtails  serious debate.I assume you would say in your usual crude and unreasoned manner "it's only baanter inn'it".

John Hawkes ● 2d

The truth is of course is that we were kicked out of the Erasmus scheme as a punishment"oh, were we not 'holding all the cards'???

Michael Brigo ● 2d

Don't worry about it, John. It's clearly beyond your blinkered little frame of reference. You'd be better off investigating who hacked into your log on details; I still owe them a pint.

Gerry Boyce ● 2d

Mr Ixer'Add to that the number of US researchers that are apparently looking for jobs in Europe because of the hostile environment for science there (cuts in NASA and other science institutions' budgets, climate denial, vaccine skepticism, cuts in environmental work, ...)'As usual you exaggerate as the US free enterprise system will always accommodate innovative research providing it can be seen to lead to a general societal benefit (which includes profit for re-investment) and is not just a woke day dream such as are Ed Miliband's eco schemes.And you contradict yourself by saying the EU countries should work more closely together to match the research being done in the US which you say is being squeezed.Is research in the US being constrained or is it running past what is happening in the EU ?I note that GSK is moving its facilities to the US that you find so hostile to bio-medical research. - "GSK plans a $30 billion investment in US R&D and manufacturing, including $1.2 billion for advanced facilities and AI technologies.The investment trend is influenced by US policies promoting domestic manufacturing, coinciding with a decline in UK pharma investments".

John Hawkes ● 2d

Boycie'Erasmus is one of the best post-war European inventions allowing students to come together from different European nations.” -  Denis MacShane, a former Europe Minister.Did he say why it was superior to an arrangement negotiated directly between an individual student, funded by the existing UK university student loan scheme, and the EU university and furthermore why it needed £570 million to fund it ?Do you know why ? And what are these 'nationalist divisions that have done and do so much damage to the different communities that constitute the EU.'How are we now divided from France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Portugal etc etc (except of course when it comes to football !)We are certainly all united in facing up to the problems arising from the immigration tides that lap all of our shores.

John Hawkes ● 2d

StevenAs I asked Ms Bond, what did the Erasmus scheme offer in practical terms such that it is worth us paying £570 million to participate in it ?That would fund many less well off UK students studying at UK universities which as you point out are superior to most European ones anyway.The truth is of course is that we were kicked out of the Erasmus scheme as a punishment which is ironic as the EU supposedly is all for free movement of people.

John Hawkes ● 2d

Ms BondCan you enlighten me over the Erasmus scheme.Surely, whether we are in the EU or not, providing the UK student could fund the fees, what is there to stop the EU university from accepting their application to study there ?I am sure they are happy to accept money from Chinese applicants.Similarly, in reverse.UK universities are pretty much dependent on fees paid by Chinese students.So why can't they accept fee paying students from the EU ?

John Hawkes ● 2d

Ms Holliday'Sue,The students will need visas to come to the UK in the same way that UK students will need visas to go to the EU'.Unless they travel here by dinghy !.

John Hawkes ● 2d

Francesca Albanese has been sanctioned by the US - making daily life very difficult.I believe some journalist have been sanctioned too.oligarchs are not ordinary people of course. It just seems odd that many a UK politician were happy to receive benefits from them previously.Perhaps more questions should be asked about how they managed to buy such assets in the first place?Another case of standards it seems!https://www.aljazeera.com/video/newsfeed/2025/12/6/francesca-albanese-tells-al-jazeera-us-sanctions-have-made-her-non-personhttps://www.un.org/unispal/document/un-experts-statement-08aug25/

Ed Robinson ● 2d

Steven, I guess the EU has a bigger catchment area for students so an imbalance isn't suprising; have you checked the same statistics for, say, Germany? Don't forget the cream of those students may stay for additional research projects at Imperial, UCL, Kings, Oxbridge, etc or join UK companies (well, those that can stay post Brexit :-( ). And some may go to institutions such as ESA, CERN, Eumetsat, etc that the UK is a partner in.Add to that the number of US researchers that are apparently looking for jobs in Europe because of the hostile environment for science there (cuts in NASA and other science institutions' budgets, climate denial, vaccine skepticism, cuts in environmental work, ...) and can contribute to European research. To match US and Chinese research Europe needs to combine its resources. Don't forget research breeds Innovation that should attract innovation and, when applied to real world problems, generate wealth. I suppose long term the UK could also benefit from the Turing scheme but it's a lot easier to work with our neighbours where we've helped create collaborative ventures already ...

Michael Ixer ● 2d

European cooperation for Universities is obviously a good thing.Until details are revealed including cost, we do not know if it is good or bad.Let's see the detail.According to some reports the scheme used to cost the UK £300 million now it is being reported that it will be £1 billion!It's easy to get headlines. But when political parties are no transparent it's usually for a reason.I personally have stopped listening to the budget as it is completely meaningless since Labour's Brown. It is the delayed detail that is important.In fact one has today have to ask what other news did this bury??

Ed Robinson ● 2d

Personally, I’d be in agreement with Denis MacShane, a former Europe Minister who said, “This is a very strong signal that the decade of Brexit isolation from Europe under PMs like Boris Johnson and Liz Truss is over. Erasmus is one of the best post-war European inventions allowing students to come together from different European nations.”“As usual  there are cheese paring bean counters in Whitehall and the anti-Europen parties like Reform and the Conservatives who oppose rejoining Erasmus on cost grounds, but it is a very small investment with a big return in building a new generation in Britain and on the continent who can overcome nationalist divisions that have done and do so much damage to the different communities that constitute the EU.” Indeed.

Gerry Boyce ● 2d

In 2020, the last year in which the UK participated in Erasmus,  the UK sent 9900 students to other countries while 16 000 came here.  This may have something to do with the fact that, according to the QS world university ranking, four of the top ten universities in the world are British while no EU university makes it into the top twenty. So the £570 million which the UK is paying into the Erasmus programme is likely to benefit foreign rather than British students.

Steven Rose ● 2d

I'd forgotten it was the double whammy - distance AND funding.  It was a scheme targeted at the few who could probably travel and study abroad without needing any extra funding.  One much more likely to shut down greater overseas opportunities and understanding for a lot of students.

Philippa Bond ● 3d

"I wonder if Labour will ever get back in greater touch with its traditional voters outside London.  According to a YouGov poll their support is down to 10% in Wales.""Labour members quitting in droves? That’s the best news Keir Starmer’s had all yearThe more Corbynistas tear up their membership cards, the brighter Labour’s prospects grow"Michael Deacon. Telegraph. 28/11/2020I'd guess that the tide towards Reform will continue and that they will win power. They need to show people what they are made of. Talk being cheap (in the short term anyway). It is all probably purely theoretical for me. That might be lucky.

David Ainsworth ● 3d

Sue,The students will need visas to come to the UK in the same way that UK students will need visas to go to the EU.

Ivonne Holliday ● 3d

But, as far as I understand, the Turing Scheme did not work well for students here, in particular, for poorer students.Students taking part in the government’s post-Brexit replacement for the EU’s Erasmus+ student exchange scheme were forced to drop out because places were confirmed too late, while others failed to receive funding until after their return, according to analysis.The first official analysis of the Turing scheme found that four out of five universities (79%) had difficulties with the application process, which was overly complex, repetitive and “tedious”.They also complained that the window for applications was too short and even after efforts were made to streamline the process, few thought there was any real improvement.“There was a general view that some delivery issues raised had a greater impact on participants from a disadvantaged background and may have created barriers to many participating.

Gerry Boyce ● 3d

This is excellent news for our students and just as much for our universities who need  the additional income.The Erasmus scheme was one of the great successes coming out of European collaboration.  There were never any reported problems in the past from Turkish or other students from other countries demonised during the Brexit campaign, so it is absolutely typical of Daily Mail scaremongering and negativity to suggest there will suddenly be an influx of undesirable foreigners now we have rejoined it.A quick Google search will tell you all you need to know about how students are selected and how UK universities can decide who to take and who not to. Incoming students will need to get visas so it is not exactly an open door policy.The useless and unpopular Turing scheme supposedly gave students opportunities to study at US, Canadian, Australian and other unis but did NOT cover travel costs!

Jonathan Callaway ● 3d

Turing was designed, and worked for UK students, and that’s good enough for me.

Sue Hammond ● 3d

@IvonneBut will they be vetted correctly, or at all?    This is vitally important and I cannot find any information about it.  Do you know anything about it Ivonne?

Sue Hammond ● 3d

This sounds like a rehash of the Brexit campaign when Johnson used Turkey as the bogeyman for hordes of immigrants coming over. The Turing Scheme, a poor replacement for Erasmus, and only operating one-way i.e. no incoming students, got pretty poor reviews; laborious paperwork, uncertain funding etc.At least the Erasmus functions well and works both ways so that Uni's and students here also benefit from all that foreign students have to offer.I think it's great that young people will have something to feel positive about, at long last.

Gerry Boyce ● 3d

I wonder if Labour will ever get back in greater touch with its traditional voters outside London.  According to a YouGov poll their support is down to 10% in Wales.

Martine Guy ● 3d

Sue,Please understand it is up to the UK to accept students or not.  That has always been the case!

Ivonne Holliday ● 3d

It's great news and will bring us and all of our youngsters back into greater touch with our nearest neighbours.Many wouldn't have wanted to go further afield than Europe - certainly as a start in their careers. 

Philippa Bond ● 3d

Thousands of Turkish students could come to UK as Starmer hands EU £570M a YEAR to rejoin Erasmus scheme sparking furious backlash.“Keir Starmer is facing outrage today after agreeing to hand the EU £570million to rejoin the Erasmus student exchange programme.Ministers insisted the deal is 'fair and balanced' despite confirming the eye-watering cost for the first year alone.On an annual basis the sum is double what Boris Johnson rejected as too expensive in 2021. It is equivalent to roughly a fifth of the entire EU funding envelope for Erasmus+, although the government insists a chunk of the money will go on British students' travels and subsequent years are still up for negotiation.Students from Turkiye will be eligible to come to the UK in 2027, as the country is an 'associate' member of the scheme. And Brussels has already signalled it wants to expand the arrangements to cover countries such as Egypt, Algeria and Morocco.When the UK was a member of the scheme previously, far more students came here than went to Europe. Government aides played down the risk of people overstaying visas once they had made it to Britain for courses, which will range from two to 12 months. However, Tories accused the PM of 'exposing Britain to all sorts of risks' as he tries to 'suck up' to the EU.  The UK is thought to have pushed for a 50 per cent discount on membership fees, which are calculated on the basis of a country's GDP.However, Sir Keir caved after the EU only offered a 30 per cent reduction of fees in the first year. Extraordinarily, the government has been boasting about achieving this 'discount'. The arrangement will get back up and running in time for the 2027-28 academic year. The government said today: 'The UK contribution for 2027 will be approximately £570million.”https://mol.im/a/15391567Yay!!  Potentially more Algerian and Moroccan sex offenders will be able to come to the UK posing as students …We already have the comprehensive Turing student exchange scheme which was set up in 2021 so why does we need to rejoin the eye-wateringly expensive Erasmus scheme? ‘The Turing scheme is a student exchange programme. It was established by the United Kingdom Department for Education in 2021 as a replacement for the European Union Erasmus Programme. The scheme aims to fund the advantages of overseas learning to three categories of participants, young students at primary and secondary schools, older sixth form students and further education university students.’

Sue Hammond ● 3d

Another bit of great news; Keir Starmer said the UK had issued a licence "to transfer £2.5bn from the sale of Chelsea Football Club that's been frozen since 2022.""My message to Abramovich is clear: the clock is ticking. Honour the commitment that you made and pay up now, and if you don't we're prepared to go to court and ensure that every penny reaches those whose lives have been torn apart by Putin's illegal war."Mr Abramovich, the former owner of Chelsea Football Club, pledged in 2022 that money from the sale of the club would be used to benefit victims of the Russian invasion of Ukraine.Well done, Labour. This is much more like it!

Gerry Boyce ● 3d

Yes, excellent news for the youth of our country - and for Europe. It's great to have some good news. 

Michael Ixer ● 3d

I totally agree, Gerry, great news at last!!!!Rejoining the Erasmus programme (and I assume the Entente Cordiale Scholar too) is absolutely fantastic. :-) :-) :-)

Ivonne Holliday ● 3d