Forum Topic

Not a good time to rejoin EU?

As Surkur Starmer edges closer to rejoining the EU the US issues 50% tariffs on imports from that organisation.Apart from a minority govt with 9m votes looks to overturn the vote of 17m is it really attractive to rejoin and tie future govts to his agreements?

Andy Pike ● 68d21 Comments

From what I recall Starmer not just voted for Boris deal but whipped his MPs to vote for it too.The numbers show Labour votes were not needed or asked for.A deal backed by the government and opposition!

Ed Robinson ● 66d

"The substance of the fishing deal hasnt changed"The concept of time seems to escape many on the forum. The Boris deal had or was about to expire.To negotiate a new deal that lasts 12 years and claim the substance of the deal has not changed is very misleading.Imagine being lucky enough to pay off your mortgage and then being told it has been extended for 12 years!

Ed Robinson ● 66d

Boris, under extreme pressure, negotiated a transitional deal which would have seen sovereignty over fishing waters return to Britain next year. Instead Keir Starmer has given EU boats the right to fish in British waters until 2038, a deal which will decimate the British fishing industry. What exactly does Britain get out of this deal?

Steven Rose ● 66d

"The UK has sovereignty over the waters, including the fishing rights. Allowing other countries to fish in those waters is a change in sovereignty."The substance of the fishing deal hasnt changed - go talk to Boris about it.

Michael Brigo ● 66d

Perhaps we should all be thankful that the fishing rights were just given away and we didn't pay billions of pounds to take them!The UK has sovereignty over the waters, including the fishing rights. Allowing other countries to fish in those waters is a change in sovereignty.Fishing rights should have nothing to do with a trade deal. However the UK is not self sufficient in energy generation and is reliant on the EU. As much as 20% second quarter of 2024.If post Brexit and pre-Brexit governments had done their job we would still have sovereignty over the waters. Britannia doesn't rule the waves it seems!

Ed Robinson ● 66d

Ms Holliday'And the deal has to be approved by the EU Council as well'. I understand that this body is made up of Heads of the member states.They are not likely to have our interests at heart.

John Hawkes ● 66d

Mr Brigo'The fishing industry contributes to GDP approx the same as the tattoo industry.Plus a quarter of the boats are controlled by foreign companies.I don't see the need to jump up and down about this.'Just keep an eye open for all those foreign chappies with interesting accents coming over and starting up women's keep fit classes !

John Hawkes ● 66d

Who is giving up sovereignty? I do not understand why you say this.  It is a trade deal, not joining the EU.  Parliament has a role to play here too. And the deal has to be approved by the EU Council as well.

Ivonne Holliday ● 66d

Well said, Michael, and a useful antidote to the hysterical ‘ the destruction of the British fishing industry in the reset with the EU’ on another thread when it’s just an extension of the existing deal.

Jane Carter ● 66d

"The fishing industry contributes to GDP approx the same as the tattoo industry."If you decimate your industries and give away the resources then of course the GDP will be low.Why if it is of no importance do you think the EU wants access?One of the reasons is that it supports many coastal towns without fishing they would become high unemployment areas as we have seen here in the UK. Requiring high social spending. The secondary jobs would also go.Then there is the concern about fish stocks.Of course if we had sovereignty over our waters we would have to police them. I guess there are some that would see that as a waste of time too!

Ed Robinson ● 66d

The fishing industry contributes to GDP approx the same as the tattoo industry. Plus a quarter of the boats are controlled by foreign companies.I don't see the need to jump up and down about this.

Michael Brigo ● 66d

"Does the deal have to be approved by Parliament?"I think they may be stretching the executive powers - which is oddly a claim made against Trump.Whichever way you voted Parliament has proved to be inadequate to say the least.If many other European countries can hold referendum on such issues I see no reason why constitutional issues should not be put to the people.I suspect many in Parliament do not actually believe in democracy.

Ed Robinson ● 67d

Does the deal have to be approved by Parliament? If so will be interesting to see how the 'red wall' MPs vote. If not , why not?

Andy Pike ● 67d

Giving up sovienty without the people's consent was one of the many causes of Brexit.It seems no lessons have been learnt.If the EU knew that the government had to consult the people the EU deal would have been a lot better.Instead they got a last minute concession from a short term politician. So no change there then!

Ed Robinson ● 67d

Hello Robert,I think most of the voters waiting eagerly for the next general election to get rid of the Conservatives, if you remember.I am no Labour supporter by any stretch of the imagination, but I am delighted with Starmer's "EU reset".  It is the biggest market right at our doorstep.  Brexit? Yes, the Leave vote had it.  But, they never had an option of voting for a "no deal" or a deal.Ditching trade with the EU was the biggest mistake ever!!  Ask all those fishermen in Yorkshire that went bust because of the cost of exporting to the EU.From my part, I will never EVER forgive them for cancelling the Erasmus programme.  Did you know, that Cruella Braverman went to France on the Erasmus programme while studying her undergraduate course?  Not only that, she attended the Entente Cordiale Scholarship Programme in the Sorbonne to study French and European Law?  GrrrrNo, we are not joining the EU at the moment, but getting closer in trade terms and allowing education - and hopefully musicians - to progress."Never before has a Government lied so much to achieve so little."  My goodness, you have very short memory!

Ivonne Holliday ● 67d

For the most l think the majority of all voters are waiting for the next general election to get rid of this Government completely.  Personally for me it was beyond insulting when Starmer announcing this “EU reset” said that the majority of the public were happy because they could now get through passport control easier.  Never before has a Government lied so much to achieve so little.

Robert Wheeler ● 67d

I wouldn't worry too much about us rejoining the EU. The government appears determined to stick to its red lines of not rejoining either the customs union or the single market.This modest reset deal has however been welcomed by most business leaders including the Confederation of Small Businesses and the CBI.  It has also been welcomed by exporters of foodstuffs, from shellfish to beef, by the pharmaceuticals industry and more.  Why?  Because it removes some of the costly bureaucracy involved in transporting goods from this country to the EU.As for the fishing industry, nothing is actually changing other than Johnson's deal being extended for a further 12 years.Meanwhile, the UK defence industry is delighted as it will get access to the new EU £150bn Security Action for Europe (Safe) fund set up in response to the growing threat from Russia.The youth mobility scheme the EU is keen on has not been agreed, as yet, but when it is it will be reciprocal and good for our tourism and education sectors.  Also, we will rejoin Erasmus+ which supports UK students wanting to study in the EU.  That surely is good news too.All in all it sounds like a pretty good start to improving our trading relationship with our nearest neighbours who are proving a whole lot more reliable to deal with than the US under its current president.We might even be able to get through customs more quickly on our next trip to the EU.The cries of betrayal and surrender seem somewhat hysterical to me.  These cries are not coming from most of the 17mn Brexit voters, just the usual suspects in the right wing press and in parliament.

Jonathan Callaway ● 67d

I think you have answered the fish question but there is also the question about the free movement of Labour when economies are not aligned.Obviously the government has addressed some of the differences by leveling down the UK economy. However lots of UK  graduates (and others) are looking for employment. This will not be helped by even move competition from abroad where unemployment rates in many EU countries are far higher.

Ed Robinson ● 67d

Ms Bond'We exported and still do export a lot of fish to the EU and hopefully this will continue and grow.'But I understood that the 'arrangement' Starmer has come to with the EU gives them (especially the French) the right to also fish in 'our' waters often with an industrialised fishing fleet.'Under a new deal, European trawlers will be granted access to British waters for a further 12 years.A previous agreement, reached under Prime Minister Boris Johnson, saw the UK regain 25 per cent of EU fishing quotas, but this was set to run out next year.Now the EU will maintain unfettered access to the UK's coastal waters until 2038'.I also read that - "A spokesman for France's Martime Prefecture said: 'On Thursday, May 22, the French Navy's public service patrol vessel, the Pluvier, conducted a fishing inspection in the French Exclusive Economic Zone, off the Somme Bay.'During this operation, which was part of the State's maritime enforcement, a British fishing vessel was inspected by sailors from the Navy patrol vessel while fishing without a license in French waters.'As the offence was proved, the fishing vessel was diverted during the night of May 23rd to the port of Boulogne-sur-Mer, following the instructions of the Delegate for the Sea and Coastline, acting on behalf of the Regional Prefect, who oversees the fisheries police, for the purpose of initiating prosecution under the authority of the Public Prosecutor.'The spokesman added: 'This operation demonstrates the vigilance of State services in protecting fisheries resources and their determination to enforce regulations".Perfidious frogs !If only our Labour Government were as diligent and determined to protect our interests as are the French.

John Hawkes ● 67d

Well we wont be exporting much fish to the EU after this agreement. We've told them to come and help themselves.

Andy Pike ● 67d

We exported and still do export a lot of fish to the EU and hopefully this will continue and grow.It would be good too to get some more fresh vegetables from Europe instead of from other continents so much further away if we can't be bothered to grow it here.  It may disappoint my young grandson though as he is trying to find fruit and vegetables on sale here from each and every continent.  It is easier than finding anything much grown locally.  Green beans from Senegal, Broccoli from Jordan, Bananas from Colombia, a pomegranate from Peru and white seedless grapes from India being his latest finds.  It makes it harder to find local British produce amongst so much that isn't.

Philippa Bond ● 67d