Forum Topic

The Birmingham Bin Strike

I haven’t taken much notice of the bin strike in my home city, except when news reports describe the size of the rats.  However I read the report in The Times today about the reason for the strike “Birmingham bin workers are striking over the council’s plan to scrap the waste recycling and collection officer role, which the union Unite describes as “safety critical”.  The officer walks alongside the wagon to ensure the driver and two refuse collectors safely navigate the streets”. Is this something that happens in Wandsworth?  Just wondered?

Martine Guy ● 90d27 Comments

It really does make you thankful for a good regular organised collection but that does take give and take and goodwill on all sides. So many other countries don't have this and the waste that ends up in our rivers ends up in our seas and oceans and travels the globe.https://wasteaid.org/about/

Philippa Bond ● 69d

Odd that the press has not called for a document that details the council's offer.Perhaps I missed this publication, however when I look at the reports about the strike they are very vague about the offer.At this stage of the game the council should be putting in writing their offer and letting residence see what the union has refused.If the council was being transparent surely they would publish their offer? Why haven't they?Nothing worse than woolly reports whilst residence are swamped with rubbish and rats!

Ed Robinson ● 69d

BTW Andy  Privatisation of recycling and waste collections has NOT been the wonderfully smooth deal promised and it might look like now in many places.  I've watched it take years to get a good collection going partly because there was nobody from the privatised company overseeing the work being done by the operatives to make sure that the streets were clear and bins put back as promised and required. Some Councils even feel forced to remind their residents of their responsibilities regarding the safeguarding of their waste but thankfully many take pride in keeping their neighbourhoods clean and tidy and there are some of these people working hard in Birmingham.

Philippa Bond ● 70d

I didn't hear that it was either.  People everywhere have to take some responsibility for the waste they make and many will be taking their separated dry recycling and other bulky waste which is easier for them to deal with direct to recycling sites.  Birmingham is way behind a lot of the UK in not having a food waste collection which will mean a lot of their residual waste will be horribly wet and smelly.  Hopefully they will get it up and running soon - as just like Wandsworth they will be getting the money from Defra to set it up.

Philippa Bond ● 70d

And presumably you dont know that it wasnt

Andy Pike ● 70d

I read that the army were providing some logistical and planning support and not collecting rubbish.Some other local authorities had offered to open their HWRCs to Birmingham residents who were trying to dispose of waste as there were long queues to Birmingham's ones.  I don't know that this was taken up.

Philippa Bond ● 70d

Are you trying to gaslight me, Mr Hawkes? Isn't it spring, and wasn't William from Stratford with time spent working in London?Yes, I guess if you can't manage to implement a standard IT package product then perhaps running a bin collection would prove difficult as well ....

Michael Ixer ● 71d

Unfortunately there are locals who are complaining that although they are managing to deal with their rubbish and recycling themselves they have problems with outsiders taking avantage and dumping bulky waste in their neighbourhoods.

Philippa Bond ● 71d

Let's not forget the indirect costs from this fiascoIs this yet more incompetence by the Labour local authority??"A waste management company has estimated that the total cost of the clean-up from the strikes is over £200m – a cost that they say could result in council tax going up."https://news.sky.com/video/birmingham-bin-strikes-clean-up-could-cost-over-200m-13348922

Ed Robinson ● 71d

Mr Ixer'They're now using consultants to fix the botched IT implementation that overran by around £80m'Can't empty the bins; cant design, code and implement a computer system.'Now is the winter of our discontent'.By Brum's greatest son.... !

John Hawkes ● 71d

I understand they also need to come into line with British law and offer food waste collections as part of their separate waste and recycling collections in Birmingham.  Change often doesn't come easily. In the bigger picture making more waste is a huge cost to everyone and the planet. 

Philippa Bond ● 71d

Labour accused the conservatives of not budgeting for pay rises. The so-called black hole.It's a bit odd then that after killing economic growth that Labour's pay rise to teachers is not fully funded.Schools are expected to find half the money through efficiencies.With a high percentage of the costs being staff does that mean less staff?Where are these efficiencies going to come from?

Ed Robinson ● 71d

Hi Andy,"I read somewhere that the 20 odd posts affected have all been offered alternative jobs at the same grade."That appears not be the case as stated by the BBC & Unite. Another BBC webpage below says the local authority says that 17 people will get 6 months pay protection.Organisations have to modernise as the environment & technology changes.This should be a continuous process within any organisation.Although working practices that have existed for years can complicate matters.However in this case it looks like the situation has been made worse by previous bad management decisions, which I'm not sure anyone can defend.I do not have confidence that we have the whole truth from the local authority and they are doubling down on yet another bad decision and possibly not thought through the consequences of their actions.Unite have asked for so called reported offers to be put in writing so they can put it to their members.The losers will be the public that I think we can agree.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdjg07xvnnjo "The local authority claims the number of staff that could lose the maximum amount (just over £6,000) is 17 people and they will have pay protection for six months."

Ed Robinson ● 72d

That makes shocking reading Andy but I am not in the least bit surprised, which is even more shocking!  The Unions have been allowed to become far too powerful and with this Labour shower-in-power they're backing a winner every time.  Now the teachers have piped up again despite their bumper pay increase last September"Teachers have threatened to strike over pay despite being handed a bumper increase by the Government in September last year. Delegates of the NASUWT teaching union have warned the Government that any pay reward which is not “fully funded” will be rejected, as they voted to “step up” their campaigning at a conference in Liverpool.The union is attempting to secure real-terms payaward for teachers next academic year and has called on the union’s committee to “to reject any pay award that is not fully funded and to move immediately to ballot members for industrial action.” This comes after the National Education Union (NEU), threatened to launch a ballot on strike action if the Government did not improve its pay offer to teaches which it branded “unacceptable”. The move threatens to place additional stress on Chancellor Rachel Reeves’bottom line and has the potential to embarrass the Government for its decision to award teachers with a pay rise just over six months ago."Expect more strikes to follow ...

Sue Hammond ● 72d

Of course, the equal pay issue that sparked the bin strike isn't their only issue. They're now using consultants to fix the botched IT implementation that overran by around £80m - when I say "fix", I believe that means going back and starting again. Expensive, but at least it might work this time! But I assume in the meantime their systems are limping along?

Michael Ixer ● 72d

If they want a copy of thè job description why not ask one of the strikers for it? The job they want to scrap is one that was created as part of the settlement of thd last strike. It's a non job.I read somewhere that the 20 odd posts affected have all been offered alternative jobs at the same grade.In my early days at Wandsworth the bin  men regularly held thd Council to ransom hence Wandsworth being the 2nd authority in the country to.privatise them.Some of the restrictive practices were  mind blowing.5 men to a crew but if 1 man went sick the 4 remaining shared his wages but he still got his. Ie 5 men working but 6 paid.Wet weather bonus    whenever it rained or snowed the agreement was that they should stop work and catch up on overtime. In reality they carried on working and still got paid for the period of wet weather.Mechanical breakdown  if a truck broke down they were paid overtime at time plus rates for catching up. Etc etc  etcI remember one guy regularly getting paid for over 90 hours in a week when the reality was he was working for about 30 before driving his cab in the afternoon.

Andy Pike ● 72d

It seems the council want to cut pay depending upon who you believe between £6,000 to £8,000.Even taking the council's claimed £6,000 which is possibly a 18% drop in wages."WRCOs are on a higher pay band than the loaders - £26,409 to £32,654. We asked Birmingham City Council for their full job description but were not given it."Why what are the council hiding?"Max Winthrop, a member of the Law Society's Employment Law Committee, said: "I'd normally expect the spinal point on the higher grading to be maintained when a lower graded post was offered."Something's not quite right with the council's figures.The cost of the clean up will cost millions. Plus indirect loses!The council have a very bad record with following labour law and not being transparent - need I say more?https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c89gd90ny9xo

Ed Robinson ● 72d

Eventually Rachel from accounts will be told by her union masters to dig another black hole to settle this one, until the next one comes along. Then tax increases that she will blame on TrumpSimples

Andy Pike ● 72d

I don’t know how they will end this strike.  I think it was on Jeremy Vine this week someone suggested sending in the army to clear the rubbish but others made the point that this isn’t what people join the army to do.  Also someone said what message does this send to China, if they were to see the British Army acting as binmen. As someone proud to be from Brum, I am worried about the image of the City.  Brummies take enough criticism as it is, without this.  

Martine Guy ● 72d

Barbara:  The subject of the thread is NOT JUST Birmingham but the non-collection of waste which attracts rats.  Why do you always have to look at the downside of absolutely everything?  There are plenty of rats in London but because we don't have the problems that Birmingham has with the non-collection of waste they are mostly underneath us in the sewers. We are lucky that we have regular waste collections.

Philippa Bond ● 88d

Oh dear Philippa, in some other countries like Birmingham, which is the subject. All the rats and fleas can also start spreading to neighboring towns, who will then also be over run by them. As for mudlarking a bit more like looking for old articles rings etc.

Barbara Stevens ● 89d

It's really bad when waste isn't sorted and separated before it is thrown away as the volume of smelly waste then becomes so greatly increased.  We are so lucky to have good collections and to be increasingly using what is collected as new resources.  In some other countries there aren't any collections at all and there is an interesting charity Wasteaid working on this.  There are also countries and communities who have little and make little waste.It is also interesting how waste makes its way into rivers and oceans and where containerloads of something eg flipflops and Lego are identified as having dispersed and travelled in ocean currents across the globe.As I write there is an item on mudlarking on the Thames on the radio..  Didn't someone in Putney write a book on this?

Philippa Bond ● 89d

As well as fleas and rats, the stink must be awful. By the way, have you ever seen a female refuse collector?  I never have but that doesn’t mean there aren’t any.

Martine Guy ● 90d

@Mr HawkesYour Jonathan Swift quote describes the multi levels of NHS management perfectly.  When I spent 9 months in hospital in 2023 I witnessed this myself.  Sorry, not relevant to this thread.🫢

Sue Hammond ● 90d

Ms Guy' The officer walks alongside the wagon to ensure the driver and two refuse collectors safely navigate the streets”.I do hope he is carrying a red flag as was the case in the days of the first railways !But have the union not thought how dangerous this job is ?Should there not also be someone walking alongside this officer to enhance his safety ?"Great fleas have little fleas upon their backs to bite 'em, And little fleas have lesser fleas, and so ad infinitum. And the great fleas themselves, in turn, have greater fleas to go on; While these again have greater still, and greater still, and so on." This is a quote by Jonathan Swift from 1732.Fleas probably quite a problem in rat infested Birmingham !

John Hawkes ● 90d

Thanks for the reply, Andy.  Maybe Brum should employ contractors?  What a miserable situation.  Rats the size of dogs, it’s the stuff of nightmares.

Martine Guy ● 90d

It doesnt happen anywhere else. This 'role' was added to the crews in Birmingham a few years back as part of a deal to solve another bin strike.You couldnt make it up.Also the Birmingham refuse is collected by directly employed staff whereas Wandsworth and many other Boroughs employ contractors and have done since Chopes day in the late 70s.

Andy Pike ● 90d