Forum Topic

Gary Lineker biased remarks unacceptable, BBC says

Is this pushing "bias" a bit too far?  Lioneker presents a football programme, not a news programme!!!https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-64889868

Ivonne Holliday ● 414d143 Comments

Barbara, have you ever wondered if Philippa is a Bot? Artificial Intelligence?

Katrina Black ● 409d

Oh,yes Philippa, we will get a life like yours, googling everything to make out you know everything. On every Forum on the planet, you don't need to watch TV you probably don't have one.

Barbara Stevens ● 409d

from Sir Richard Evans, Regius Professor Emeritus of History at Cambridge and author of at least four books on the Third Reich:"I'm not the only historian of modern Germany to find that the UK government scheme to deport asylum seekers to a tropical part of Africa irresistibly reminds them of the failed Nazi scheme to deport Jews to Madagascar"once again:"language not dissimilar"

Michael Winstanley ● 410d

Sugar forwarded this one too:-tinyurl.com/yrbw5cxmPaving the way for Johnson - a safe pair of hands.

David Ainsworth ● 410d

Interesting. Of course, this is an example of language used in the UK in the 30's, not in Germany.I do think that the crucial point about the Lineker furore is his right to freedom of speech in his own time, regardless of what he actually said.However, for those whose focus is his actual words and who are complaining of a wholly inaccurate comparison with the holocaust, I offer the following.The holocaust was planned at and carried out subsequent to the Wannsee Conference in 1942. In the 1930's, Nazi and later, German government, propaganda was not advocating the wholesale extermination of Jews. Rather, it gently began to inculcate in the population the idea that Jews were inferior and an enemy of the state - it dehumanised and othered them. Thus a Jew was portrayed as a money grubber, who pursued his own enrichment at the expense of the nation's prosperity/ well-being and was in league with the Bolsheviks. Let me summarise: money-grubbing Bolsheviks.Then let's move to the portrayal of asylum seekers in the UK by the current government: an "invasion" of "economic migrants" supported by "woke/lefty lawyers".Now english is my first language and I am quite meticulous about the meanings of words. I am categorically certain that this can be described as "language not dissimilar" - Lineker's actual words.

Michael Winstanley ● 410d

For example. Not exactly unbiased.

Matt Palmer ● 410d

Sorry, I meant to add that the Metcalfe post was a response to your newspaper cutting.

David Ainsworth ● 410d

"“The way stateless Jews from Germany are pouring in from every port of this country is becoming an outrage,” wrote Old Street Magistrate Herbert Metcalfe on 20 August 1938, in one such example. “I intend to enforce the law to the fullest.”"https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/voice-of-the-jewish-news-once-we-were-strangers/The magistrate attempts to explain what he meant a month later in a letter to the Jewish Chronicle:-https://www.jta.org/archive/london-magistrate-who-sentenced-refugees-denies-bias-against-jewsHowever his decision was probably a death sentence for the 3 people who were to be deported.

David Ainsworth ● 410d

Philippa, I unashamedly love watching t.v.  I think it is possible to have a life as well.  Please don’t lecture me.  I am doing nothing wrong and it’s perfectly legal so long as I buy a licence Maybe if you learned to laugh a bit at a good comedy, you wouldn’t be so eager to tell everyone else how to live their life.  
Out of interest do you represent some know all organisation?

Martine Guy ● 410d

There is no reason why you should watch TV at all.  It steals your time - find something else to do.  Learn something new - do something new.  I've never heard such a lot of tosh about not wanting to fund the BBC when you don't need to.  Just ditch the TV and don't watch it - Get yourself a LIFE instead of watching other people live theirs.  You don't have to pay the licence fee if you don't have a TV and don't watch TV programmes.https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/faqs/FAQ104

Philippa Bond ● 410d

"I think Lineker will bring the organisation down which for me will be a good thing."The Tory government have that aim too, certainly.

David Ainsworth ● 410d

"re: your comment £0.065, your lack of understanding on people’s everyday struggles in a cost of living crisis are the sort of thing I hear from Conservative voting acquaintances, not something I would expect from someone on the Left."Yeah, good try. Your party have been in power since 2010 though, so people's everyday struggles are down to them. And they might well still pull it off again at the 2024 election.

David Ainsworth ● 410d

Someone on FB recently posted this article from the Daily Mail in the 1930s. Sadly, the tone of the language seems very similar to some I've heard recently ... (unfortunately they didn't annotate it with the exact date but it matches with stuff my late father spoke about)

Michael Ixer ● 410d

"As Tony Kushner, professor of history at the University of Southampton, says, “The Daily Mail has been an anti-alien newspaper since the 1900s. There’s great continuity.”" [Observer 2002"What academic perception !

John Hawkes ● 410d

I agree with you wholeheartedly Martine.The problem on this forum is that many of the Lineker supporters are also very wealthy and don't understand about the cost of living crisis.If they think it is OK for the taxpayer to pay Lineker 1.3M for a one hour slot every Saturday evening then it goes to show how out of touch they are with the general public.I think Lineker will bring the organisation down which for me will be a good thing.#defundtheBBC

John Lambert ● 410d

I think it is true because Lineker seems to have a lot of power at the BBC.  Regular viewing figures for MOTD are just over 2 million. Not that fantastic?  Sue Barker had to step down from Question of Sport at age 64, so presumably Lineker won’t have too long to retirement.  Enough to pick up at least £2million more of licence fee. re: your comment £0.065, your lack of understanding on people’s everyday struggles in a cost of living crisis are the sort of thing I hear from Conservative voting acquaintances, not something I would expect from someone on the Left.

Martine Guy ● 410d

You mention Alan Sugar Matt.Can you send a link to the article you are talking about please?

John Lambert ● 410d

On two recent occasions the BBC has apparently disclaimed responsibility for personal Twitter accounts. Open and shut case; whatever one's opinion of the contents,  it appears the BBC don't consider personal Twitter accounts their responsibility. Lineker seems to have been singled out for irregular treatment. I'm sure it's nothing to do with a Tory chum of Johnson being the new chairman? The new chairman must be sacked immediately!

Michael Ixer ● 410d

"Also MailOnline saying no-one at the BBC wants to cover for Lineker and MOTD staff because they are afraid of being “a scab”."Oh well, the ever-popular MailOnline, so it must be true - "As Tony Kushner, professor of history at the University of Southampton, says, “The Daily Mail has been an anti-alien newspaper since the 1900s. There’s great continuity.”" [Observer 2002]

David Ainsworth ● 410d

"He is just a smug, over-paid virtue signaller.Who does he remind me of I wonder?"The Church of England, perhaps?"Illegal migration bill is ‘cruelty without purpose’, says Archbishop of YorkJewish leaders join Stephen Cottrell in urging government not to penalise ‘world’s most vulnerable’ as charities and businesses voice horror in open letter"https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/mar/12/migration-bill-is-cruelty-without-purpose-says-archbishop-of-york"Criminalising the world’s most vulnerable people is an immoral and inept way of responding.”"The letter was prompted by Braverman’s description of the Channel crossings as an “invasion” the day after the firebombing of an immigration processing centre in Dover.Cottrell was not the only religious leader to speak out." "Rabbi Charley Baginsky, chief executive of Liberal Judaism, said: “As Jews, many of us are here today because a generation before us was so desperate for safety that they put themselves and their families – or sometimes just their children – through often tortuous and dangerous journeys.“How can we now turn around and send this generation of refugees back to face persecution, war or famine? The very nature of the UK and its immigration history will be ruptured for ever. It’s important that we see the humanity on these boats and the lives that can be saved, rather than try to deal with a problem by punishing the victims.”"

David Ainsworth ● 410d

You omit, perhaps on purpose, the most important part of the guidelines fromn which you are quoting:"The extent to which a non-staff member, contributor or presenter is required to comply with the editorial guidelines will be set out in the BBC’s contractual relationship with them"Lineker is not a BBC employee. He is only in breach of those guidelines if his contract expressly repeats them.Now lets look at what the BBC has said about Lineker's suspension:"Gary Lineker has been told to step back from presenting Match of the Day until an agreement is reached on his social media use"There would not be any need to reach an agreement with him if there was already one in his contract, now would there?So he is a free agent who, absent the publication of some as yet unknown further guideline or contract is free, as the majority of us are, to say what he likes on his own time. Just as anyone is perfectly free to say that they don't agree with him.

Michael Winstanley ● 410d

"Yes, the BBC has impartiality guidelines for 'high profile' names."Which seemingly are only applied depending on whether you a pro or anti-Tory. See: Alan Sugar.

Matt Palmer ● 410d

I hear viewing figures were up by 500,000 for last night’s MOTD.  Some of this will be down to curiosity and novelty value.  However, we preferred it because we could hear the crowd, and didn’t need the commentary.  If we must have pundits, get new people in and give them a chance, and on lower salaries.  Nobody is indispensable.
Also MailOnline saying no-one at the BBC wants to cover for Lineker and MOTD staff because they are afraid of being “a scab”.

Martine Guy ● 410d

Mr AinsworthSurely the real issue is not Lineker's right to voice an opinion nor what that opinion might be.It was how much latitude as an employee of a particular media outlet he should be given or take, to express an opinion that many who actually fund this outlet and hence pay his salary might object to.Especially as this funding is a legally enforced obligation for everyone and the organisation has an accepted modus operandii of not displaying political partiality in its current affairs reporting.Also most employees of any organisation work under implicit or explicit constraints dictated by their employer.Yes, the BBC has impartiality guidelines for 'high profile' names.'There are also others who are not journalists or involved in factual programmes who nevertheless have an additional responsibility to the BBC because of their profile on the BBC. We expect theses individuals to avoid taking sides on party political issues or political controversies and to take care when addressing public policy matters'. Lineker chose to ignore all of this, obviously feeling superior to it all.And, his comment was poorly argued (not argued in fact as it was just a flip comment), comparing the language used by a democratically elected government minister regarding legislation that will have to be agreed by Parliament, with that used by German Nazis in a dictatorship responsible for the deaths of millions of Jews.He is just a smug, over-paid virtue signaller.Who does he remind me of I wonder ?

John Hawkes ● 410d

Mr AinsworthPlease no more of your quotes.We know you have A-level English.

John Hawkes ● 410d

Do you think that calling another contributor ‘ God Ivonne you are as dumb as fcuk!" lies within the rules of civilised debating? Even Jo Amadi quite rightly declared your statement to be out of order.

Jane Carter ● 410d

And what do we get from Mr Lambert?:-"God Ivonne you are as dumb as fcuk!"By the way, using the Forum search, one finds:-Lambert 103 matches - about half from Mr LambertAinsworth 5769 matches - almost all of it actually by me.""Look on my Works, ye Mighty, and despair!"Nothing beside remains. Round the decayOf that colossal Wreck, boundless and bareThe lone and level sands stretch far away.”

David Ainsworth ● 410d

Re: David Ainsworth’s £0.065 If you are struggling to pay your bills, the £159 tv licence is a lot to pay.  If your yearly income is low, then maybe you aren’t paying tax or a small amount, tax that David mentions pays for the army and royal family, however on that small income you are expected to find money for all of the regular, everyday bills such as energy, food, Council tax, fares/petrol, clothing, rent/mortgage, maybe child care.  Then once a year a bill comes in for £159, it is the straw that breaks the camels back. What is the Labour Party’s policy on the licence fee?  Are they going to expect the poorest to carry on paying?  I understand it’s mostly women, including single mums, who get caught and prosecuted.

Martine Guy ● 410d

"where precisely was the new party leader during the Corbyn years?"

David Ainsworth ● 410d

"I wonder how many listeners/viewers actually do agree with Lineker over migration?"They do not have to. Why should they? They may however have views on the BBC caving in to Tory pressure and muzzling Lineker when he is tweeting on his own account.I would assume that this would apply:-"Actors, dramatists, comedians, musicians and pundits who work for the BBC are not subject to the requirements of impartiality on social media."https://www.bbc.co.uk/editorialguidelines/guidance/individual-use-of-social-media/#6whoiscoveredbythisguidanceGoogle "lineker pundit"And in about 0.45 seconds - Voila!About 29,300,000 results

David Ainsworth ● 410d

Unfortunately Ainsworth always answers a question with a question. So a pointless exercise debating with Ainsworth.

John Lambert ● 410d

Mr  Ainsworth'And where precisely was the new party leader during the Corbyn years?'So you think Starmer is as anti-semitic as Corbyn ?Do you think the latter was wrongly accused ?

John Hawkes ● 410d

Mr Ainsworth'Interesting but not surprising that soccer chaps are more staunch and supportive than is Starmer's Labour'.I think they will hold out -"I am Spartacus"- until their contracts expire and then ask the BBC to renew them.Quite touching that commentators, perhaps working for Radio Stoke on about £30K pa, are so supportive of Lineker on £1.35M from the BBC plus his salary from BT Sport.I wonder how many listeners/viewers actually do agree with Lineker over migration ?

John Hawkes ● 410d

Yesterday:- "Happily your new Party leader got rid of him and Labour can now claim a clean pair of hands when it comes to anti-Semitism."And where precisely was the new party leader during the Corbyn years?

David Ainsworth ● 410d

Mr AinsworthYet more 6th form arguments.Whether you like it or not the monarchy is key to our Constitution built up over millennia.However this can be changed if you and yours can persuade a majority of the electorate to support you.Perhaps Starmer will put it in his manifesto and nominate candidates to stand for President.Mr Khan or Mr Corbyn; or perhaps yourself ?!As regards nuclear weapons, they are a key component in the country's defence and probably even today acting as a key deterrent to Putin.'War luvvies'How puerile.

John Hawkes ● 410d

A question for Mr LambertWhy do royalist luvvies think the whole country should contribute towards the cost of the Royal Family, considering many people don't want it anymore due to its anti-democratic bias.They could find someone to do this for less than one-tenth of the price.#defundtheroyals---------------------A question for Mr LambertWhy do war luvvies think the whole country should contribute towards the cost of our nuclear weapons, considering many people don't want them anymore due to their genocidal results.They could find some army to do this for less than one-tenth of the price.#defundthenukes#subcontractwagner

David Ainsworth ● 410d

You are right Martine.Many people can't afford to pay their bills atm, so the thought of contributing to Lineker's 1.3M salary, effectively chatting in a studio about a football match is grossly unjust.They could find someone to do this for less than one-tenth of the price.#defundtheBBC

John Lambert ● 410d

Re: the TV Licence, it’s another demand for money as people struggle with increasing rent, mortgages, council tax and energy bills, etc.  I think more people are just going to stop paying. Apologies to Michael Winstanley, if my post isn’t high enough quality for his superior intellect,

Martine Guy ● 410d

Oh will nobody think of the spirit of the rules!Here's a 2021 BBC case regarding freelance Chris Packham that may provide an example:-https://twitter.com/martintheirish/status/1634550549184954370?cxt=HHwWhIC2uY7Ei68tAAAA

David Ainsworth ● 411d

Oh, well, it'll keep some lawyers from going hungry (apologies to any of my lawyer friends reading this). It also.occurred to me that Lord Sugar's lawyer could, because Lord Sugar might make comments on political matters because of his position in the HoL, negotiated some exclusions concerning this. Obviously, that's pure speculation.

Michael Ixer ● 411d

The Independent probably has it right.His contract is for two years and predates the current chairperson."Lineker is following the letter of his contract but not the spirit of the rules imposed on presenters, a senior BBC figure told The Independent."https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/bbc-gary-lineker-sack-contract-b2298816.html

Ed Robinson ● 411d

"one would assume Lord Sugar's contract would have a similar clause; why was he not sanctioned for making political statements?"I expect that one of "the finer points of the contract" is that it is only applicable to Lefties (or what the BBC are informed are seen as Lefties)."BBC officials asked for help from the intelligence services to carry out political vetting of all journalistic and engineering staff from as early as the 1930s, according to an MI5 file on relations with the corporation.""The BBC's political vetting of journalists was first exposed by the Observer newspaper in the 1980s. The corporation defended the practice as being a hangover from the cold war which was later discontinued." ("Later discontinued", of course). (From the Lefty Guardian, 2001, of course).

David Ainsworth ● 411d

Jo. One assumes so. As I noted elsewhere, this suspension period might be a pause while both sides'  lawyers look at the finer points of the contract. Interestingly, one would assume Lord Sugar's contract would have a similar clause; why was he not sanctioned for making political statements?

Michael Ixer ● 411d

"It's a shame some posters can't understand the basics."Well, lead us, leader.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

Please do you have a link to this particular code of conduct?

David Ainsworth ● 411d

You make some great points Jo. It's a shame some posters can't understand the basics.

John Lambert ● 411d

Jo,I agree with you.What drew my attention was the BBC saying they will have to look into the contract to determine the use of social media by Lineker.That indicates that there are different types of contracts in the BBC (of course!) but that the level of rigour, to put a name to it, varies from direct employees to those contracts for freelance.  Hence, the question must be, was there any sort of impartiality clauses included in Lineker's contract?  We assume there are, but now I wonder.....

Ivonne Holliday ● 411d

Mr Lambert, that comment is out of order!

Jo Amadi ● 411d

Ivonne, I'm sure we are all aware there are different types of contract!Whether the contract is as a PAYE permanent employee or as a freelance expert has no relevance here (though you may want to look up his HMRC investigations on this if you're really interested)The point is he signed up to a contract and agreed to adhere to a code of conduct. This is enforceable on employee and freelance contracts.

Jo Amadi ● 411d

"His tweet was not party political. Labour's view, yesterday at least, (today who knows? It is a bit like a spot the ball competition), was that it went too far."Yes, Labour began to change it a bit when they saw the slightly surprising way that the wind was blowing.Interesting but not surprising that soccer chaps are more staunch and supportive than is Starmer's Labour.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

The BBC UK regardless of how it is funded (advertising, subscription or a licence fee) will still be regulated by OFCOM and have to provide balanced political programming.There is no suggestion that any OFCOM rules were broken.His tweet was not party political. Labour's view, yesterday at least, (today who knows? It is a bit like a spot the ball competition), was that it went too far.The TV licence is a regressive form of tax. Very inefficient to collect and enforce so there are good reasons for getting rid of it. It should have gone years ago. It definitely shouldn't be used to provide free TV to other parts of the world whilst hounding people who do not even have a TV.The only left right argument is about free speech. It's been quite noticeable that the right have been defending free speech recently but in this instance the right have made the same mistake as the left.Does Lineker have the right to express a personal opinion that is unrelated to his work?What that opinion is is really irrelevant.

Ed Robinson ● 411d

"Then there is the armed services. Defund the defence budget. I've never had any benefit from it. There has been much disagreement over their involvement in various campaigns over the years and most of the cash seems to go on stuff which is never used except to practice."Indeed, but "most of the cash seems to go on stuff which is never used except to practice" is probably for the best.The other stuff which is used in earnest has helped us create many thousands of refugees - which is a kind of unvirtuous circle.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

"I posted this on the wrong thread."No surprise about that. Anyway, to save you the walk:-A question for Mr LambertWhy do royalist luvvies think the whole country should contribute towards the cost of the Royal Family, considering many people don't want it anymore due to its anti-democratic bias.Surely a subscription service is the only fair way to do this.---------------------A question for Mr LambertWhy do war luvvies think the whole country should contribute towards the cost of our nuclear weapons, considering many people don't want them anymore due to their genocidal results.Surely a subscription service is the only fair way to do this.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

Mr Lambert,Rudeness will get you nowhere.

Ivonne Holliday ● 411d

God Ivonne you are as dumb as fcuk!

John Lambert ● 411d

Jo,"Presenter signs contract with broadcaster. Part of the contract is that he should not get involved in expressing party political opinions on social media."Firstly, is the person employed directly by the BBC or is the person a freelance expert on whichever subject?  They have different types of contracts.From information provided by the media, the contract of a freelance expert says nothing about expressing opinions on personal social media.  As far as I understand it, the BBC needs to "look into use of personal social media accounts."

Ivonne Holliday ● 411d

I posted this on the wrong thread.Thank you Sue.A question for David.Why do BBC luvvies think the whole country should contribute towards the BBC licence fee, considering many people don't watch it anymore due to it's left wing bias.Surely a subscription service is the only fair way to do this.

John Lambert ● 411d

I'm drawn to this idea of "defunding" publicly funded services which don't bring the same benefits to each and every one of us.Defunding old age pensions would yield enormous savings to me and many others. Cogent enough that one I think.Then there is the armed services. Defund the defence budget. I've never had any benefit from it. There has been much disagreement over their involvement in various campaigns over the years and most of the cash seems to go on stuff which is never used except to practice.Whilst the BBC license fee is as little as £53.50 per annum,  the UK defence budget is several times this and the cost of old age pensions an order of magnitude more.I declare a personal interest - I get one - but I am willing to give it up for the greater good.

Michael Winstanley ● 411d

OK if you looked at this without the names involved, the facts are:Presenter signs contract with broadcaster. Part of the contract is that he should not get involved in expressing party political opinions on social media.Presenter publishes a tweet about party political issuesPresenter has breached the terms of the contract and therefore should not continue in his role.

Jo Amadi ● 411d

"Whether you think the BBC is a lefty organisation (or not) this is the most cogent argument posted in this thread.  In my opinion."Funny, I thought that "cogent" meant "clear, logical, and convincing".Still, I think that you would regret this idea if it ever came to fruition. In my opinion.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

@John Lambert"To avoid this continued division the country needs to #DefundTheBBC and make it a subscription service.It can then continue as a hard left organisation and no-one from any side of the political spectrum could then complain if it is a paid for subscription service. Lineker would then be free to spout his hard left views and continue to receive his 1.3 million salary paid for by the subscribers."Whether you think the BBC is a lefty organisation (or not) this is the most cogent argument posted in this thread.  In my opinion.

Sue Hammond ● 411d

The dimness is strong in this one Obiwon.

Michael Winstanley ● 411d

Mr Hawkes"If someone disagrees with you then they are in favour of the mass extermination of the Jews."Do you see how silly it looks?

David Ainsworth ● 411d

"It can then continue as a hard left organisation"Continue as hard left!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"The left keeps saying the BBC is impartial" BwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaGod, I can't wait for you people to take over.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

To avoid this continued division the country needs to #DefundTheBBC and make it a subscription service.It can then continue as a hard left organisation and no-one from any side of the political spectrum could then complain if it is a paid for subscription service. Lineker would then be free to spout his hard left views and continue to receive his 1.3 million salary paid for by the subscribers.The left keeps saying the BBC is impartial but it is only people from the centre right who are calling for the BBC to be defunded and turned into a subscription service.

John Lambert ● 411d

Seems the far right must be losing the argument as the insults are being brought out - why would someone be thick to support Lineker if it's the BBC who have ambiguous policies or fail to apply them evenly, as has been adequately explained elsewhere. Also, is there anything wrong in someone choosing to be on the far left if that's in line with their principles?I'll be honest, I don't watch MOTD or follow football these days but presumably the BBC pay a lot for these pundits because they know a lot about football and a significant number of licence layers want to see and hear them?

fight 

Michael Ixer ● 411d

Mr AinsworthIf someone disagrees with you then they are in favour of the mass extermination of the Jews.Nice !

John Hawkes ● 411d

"Messrs Ainsworth, Winstanley and Lineker have all just proved Godwin's Law -"the theory that as an online discussion progresses, it becomes inevitable that someone or something will eventually be compared to Adolf Hitler or the Nazis, regardless of the original topic""Try to get it right. The original topic involved the comparison. I never introduced it.Just getting silly now. Amazing the contortions rightwingers get into trying to make a point.In July 2019, the Sunday Telegraph columnist Simon Heffer claimed on LBC radio that Corbyn ‘wants to reopen Auschwitz’. Such stuff helped to give us Johnson, so good luck with your unchanging land.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

Mr Hawkes,Lineker compared the language used by Cruella Braverman, our current Home Secretary, to that used in Germany in the 1930s.Yes, Germany had suffered enormously with the Great Depression, and, for the 1932 elections, similar language was used (the one that Lineker referred to).  Hitler lost at the election but was made Chancellor in January 1933.And I disagree completely with the BBC being dismantled.  It is ludicrous!

Ivonne Holliday ● 411d

Messrs Ainsworth, Winstanley and Lineker have all just proved Godwin's Law -"the theory that as an online discussion progresses, it becomes inevitable that someone or something will eventually be compared to Adolf Hitler or the Nazis, regardless of the original topic"

John Hawkes ● 411d

No, he was comparing the language used, not the whole period.You know that. "Lineker suggesting "the language being used by the home secretary is not dissimilar to that used by Germany in the 30s" is an utter disgrace."Utter disgrace - what rubbish! You are free to argue against him, you know. But apparently Lineker is not allowed the same freedom.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

Those in support of Lineker are either equally to the hard left or either just plain thick.Lineker suggesting "the language being used by the home secretary is not dissimilar to that used by Germany in the 30s" is an utter disgrace.Please see the tweet below.https://twitter.com/DaveAtherton20/status/1634507302936911872Lineker should be sacked immediately comparing these two moments in time.All of Lineker's mates coming out in support shows just how far to the left the BBC has become. It needs to be defunded immediately and go to a subscription service. If it is as good as the lefties think, then I'm sure it will flourish.

John Lambert ● 411d

So you want the BBC to spend less on a programme you don't watch. And you have chosen to voice this opinion at this particular point in time, when Lineker's conduct outside of the programme is under discussion.I would rather they stop spending money on football coverage altogether. And also that the government stop using taxpayers' money to subsidise the sport.However, I am a supporter of public broadcasting and believe  a public broadcaster's output should match the broad spectrum of tastes of the population as a whole, not my own selfish personal whims.

Michael Winstanley ● 411d

Lineker tweeted:-"There is no huge influx. We take far fewer refugees than other major European countries. This is just an immeasurably cruel policy directed at the most vulnerable people in language that is not dissimilar to that used by Germany in the 30s, and I’m out of order?""in language that is not dissimilar to that used by Germany in the 30s"As I understand it, he wrote that their Language was not not dissimilar - not their Actions.He would have been totally free to tweet his support for their policy, language or actions. Yet that would be a supposed breach of the supposed BBC guidelines too, would it not?

David Ainsworth ● 411d

Might it not be better if the BBC as it is now were disbanded releasing everyone from being forced to buy a licence and subject to the law if they do not ?People could subscribe to its services they wanted including the news.Those who might miss out on listening to Linekar's 6th formish political opinions (where he compared to actions/comments made by the Home Secretary to those made by the Nazis) can always take out a subscription to BT Sport, for whom he also works and listen there.Then licence payers would not be funding his £1.35M salary nor the £390K earned by Alan Shearer (Tyneside's answer to Plato), £295K earned by Dan Walker, £190K by Jermaine Jenas and £120K by Ian Wright.But what I am hoping to hear is what Mary Berry thinks of the Government's handling of the illegal migration issue because I have been told her Victoria sponge recipe is to die for.

John Hawkes ● 411d

The BBC has a real problem in not applying its policy consistently. Alan Sugar was not sanctioned for negative statements about Jeremy Corbyn when Corbyn was Labour leader. Sugar is in a similar position to Lineker in that both front non news entertainment programmes for the BBC. If lawyers are involved I wouldn't back the BBC after such an inconsistency. In fact, Sugar said he'd sack Corbyn as he didn't like his politics; he'd "fire" him, an obvious reference to the BBC programme he appears in, if one looks at the language used in Daily Mail and other papers from the 1930s Lineker may well be able to prove his comment was factual, although possibly in a different context, plus his comment made no reference to his BBC work.

Michael Ixer ● 411d

That's one statue that the right would not defend as a vital part of our history.

David Ainsworth ● 411d

"Richard Sharp has been under pressure for his role in facilitating a loan agreement for Boris Johnson when he was prime minister and not declaring it as a potential conflict of interest in the appointment process when he was under consideration to be chairman of the BBC.Mr Sharp has previously admitted the affair had embarrassed the BBC but insisted he had "acted in good faith to ensure that the rules were followed".The Shadow Culture Secretary Lucy Powell has specifically linked the two cases saying "the same cries of impartiality were totally absent when the BBC Chair failed to disclose aspects of his close friendship with the then PM".The BBC is justified in arguing that it has no say in the case of the BBC chair. Mr Sharp is a political appointment, and his appointment is now being investigated by the commissioner for public appointments.But perceptions matter. And the BBC is accused by one side of coming down heavily on Gary Lineker for his anti-government rhetoric, while apparently having a chair in post who is mired in a row and has given money to the Conservatives in the past.One counter argument is that Richard Sharp, as a Board member, isn't involved in editorial matters.Plenty would say, though, neither is Gary Lineker. He has no editorial say on air about politics. Sport is his thing - and as a sports presenter, the BBC today called him "second to none"."https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-64922674Perhaps Richard Sharp should stand down for a while? Just until the investigation clears him?

David Ainsworth ● 411d

I agree Michael W.There is a change.org petition (link below) which has gathered over 133,000 signatures in 15 hours.  The text of the petition includes:"Outside the headquarters of the BBC in London is a statue of the writer George Orwell.It bears the words: “If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they don’t want to hear.”In this case, the wording should read:  "..... the right to tell the government what it does not want to hear."https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/promoted/reinstate-gary-lineker-to-match-of-the-day?source=whatsapp-share-button&utm_campaign=blast2023-03-10&utm_medium=socialshare&utm_source=whatsapp&share=7ac6a85c-cbd7-4d59-b870-fbbcbfc4764d

Ivonne Holliday ● 411d

It's all about Govts shutting down criticism.

Philippa Bond ● 412d

Ed, Thanks for this I enjoy looking at old maps and will have a look tomorrow.

Martine Guy ● 412d

The license fee also covers BBC Persia which as an overseas broadcast service is not regulated by Ofcom and have been accused amongst other things of broadcasting homophobic content.Perhaps BBC Pursia should broadcast and produce MOTD.It's a win win!Homophobic content ditched and money saved. Plus traditional british values like fair play promoted to Iran!

Ed Robinson ● 412d

Michael, I don’t watch as much as I used to on the BBC, but I still pay for a licence. I would rather they give a newcomer a chance to present MOTD, on a lower salary than Lineker.

Martine Guy ● 412d

David, this wasn’t just a queue, it was an M&S queue!

Martine Guy ● 412d

"Amusingly, all the usual libertarian, freedom of the individual, small state crowd are saying Lineker should be stamped on. And none of them seem to appreciate the irony."Well put.

David Ainsworth ● 412d

"at the back of the queue for M&S"M&S do not sell Walkers crisps!Perhaps he has a lifetime private supply!It's the best negative I have on him.There is the Corbyn tweet. Not the recent one supporting him but the one  mentioned by David.Ultimately Corbyn put his party before country which in many ways is no different to putting yourself before country as his opponents have done.Perhaps I'm wrong but Lineker on the other hand whilst playing for his team always put the game first. No yellow or red cards.We just need more Lineker like people in politics.

Ed Robinson ● 412d

But it doesn't save anyone any money. The BBC is paying all these people on contracts. It will be paying them not to appear. People who enjoy watching football on TV are being deprived of the usual commentary because the government is scared of open criticism. It's Orwellian. You've said you only occasionally watch MOTD. Your opinion as to who presents it or whether they are boring (or female) seems pretty irrelevant to the subject. If you don't usually watch it, why have so much to say about whether Lineker is on it. Be honest, if Fiona Bruce did the commentary, are you any more likely to watch it!The facts are that Lineker is not a BBC employee, does not present a news program, does not have a contract which limits his freedom of speech and chose in his own time to state his opinion about something.Most people seem to be dividing on the basis of whether they agree with that opinion, rather than whether they agree with his right to express it.Amusingly, all the usual libertarian, freedom of the individual, small state crowd are saying Lineker should be stamped on. And none of them seem to appreciate the irony.I never watch MOTD. I don't much care who presents it, so long it as their selection is not part of some government-orchestrated propaganda campaign. Then it becomes bread and circuses.

Michael Winstanley ● 412d

"As regards Lineker, we were driving through Sw13 and he was at the back of the queue for M&S during Covid.""at the back of the queue for M&S"!I bet that his false humility did not fool you! Did you tell him?

David Ainsworth ● 412d

Goto https://maps.wandsworth.gov.uk/Select 1930s Historical MapsPut the postcode SW15 5FP and you should see Covent Farm.The Orchard connected the Farm to the Sacred Heart School - some into here:https://sites.google.com/drive.sacredheart-roe.wandsworth.sch.uk/ourschoolshistory/home

Ed Robinson ● 412d

No presenter or pundits for next MOTD.  That’s an improvement, I think.   If it keeps the licence fee from increasing, it’s another plus.

Martine Guy ● 412d

Ed, where was the farm off Roehampton Lane, I love a bit of local history like this?

Martine Guy ● 412d

Barnes is a lot more sleepy now that the bridge has closed.The best non-London view IMO is near Richmond Gate on the hill looking down towards the river. Sadly the longhorn cattle that used to be in the field below have gone.There are some sheep in Barnes which you can see if you head down towards the Wetland Centre.When I was growing up the farm just off Roehampton Lane still had the occasional horse trotting along and an orchard we shouldn't have been in :)

Ed Robinson ● 412d

Ed,  I agree with Robert Elms about it.  I love Putney and immediately felt at home here. It is proper London, imo.  We first found SW13 when we took a right off URR.  I said to my husband where are we, is it the countryside?   Never heard of it before. As regards Lineker, we were driving through Sw13 and he was at the back of the queue for M&S during Covid.  It was when I first realised he lived there as I thought he lived in north London.  

Martine Guy ● 412d

I'm more of a crisp than football fan unfortunately.Barnes does have a village feel but I would describe a lot of South West London Putney, Richmond, Wimbledon etc as not really London with all the green spaces.It does of course have the famous pond from Judith Kerr's children's books. The area has always had a mixture of housing but the social mix has obviously altered as all housing in London has got more expensive.He is very talented perhaps it's his early market stall days that makes him a good communicator?I didn't know he lived in Barnes either so perhaps you are not the last to know :) A good choice of location I would have thought!

Ed Robinson ● 412d

The argument seems to be partly that he is too rich to be allowed to express an opinion, which, from rightwingers, is a novel take.

David Ainsworth ● 412d

This would be funny, except that it really isn't:-"This week the Telegraph newspaper attacked the BBC for creating the series and for taking funding from “two charities previously criticised for their political lobbying” – the WWF and RSPB." (Guardian today)The WWF and RSPB!Oh, come on!Perhaps the Telegraph is thinking of the WEF?

David Ainsworth ● 412d

Why do we need to know where Lineker lives?

Ivonne Holliday ● 412d

Good Tweet yesterday:-"Imagine thinking you can prove your government isn't flirting with fascism by suppressing any dissenting opinions."

David Ainsworth ● 412d

A friend has pointed out that, when Gary Lineker tweeted an anti-Corbyn remark a few years ago, there wasn’t a whiff of criticism from the Tory Government.

David Ainsworth ● 412d

Ivonne, thanks for the reply.  So the older lady has been replaced, that doesn’t surprise me.  Yet older men, such as Lineker, stay on our screens.  Time for him to retire, imo. Give a woman a chance.
I occasionally watch MOTD like last Saturday when Man Utd got humiliated by Liverpool and when Man Utd got thrashed by Brentford, but I find the chat by the pundits fairly boring.

Martine Guy ● 412d

Millionaire footballers in solidarity!  LOL! The thing I am surprised about is that the Conservative Party don’t pick up on where Lineker lives.  I seem to remember presenter Robert Elms describing it as not really London and how it is stuck in the 1950s.  Is it the only part of London with a duck pond as part of its village vibe? I must be the last person locally to find out where Lineker lives.

Martine Guy ● 412d

Hello Martine,It was certainly a typo, sorry!!The lady in question is a North Korean lady who was the news presenter in the official TV channel.  She received quite a bit of coverage here when Trump went to North and South Korea. She has now been replaced by a younger news presenter.As for boring Lineker, I really do not know as I do not like professional football therefore do not watch the programme. But I know he was a very successful football player when he was younger.

Ivonne Holliday ● 412d

Ian Wright"Everybody knows what Match of the Day means to me, but I’ve told the BBC I won’t be doing it tomorrow. Solidarity."

Ed Robinson ● 412d

Ian Wright, who I prefer to listen to than zzzzzzz Lineker, has also pulled out of MOTD in an act of solidarity.  What egos these 2 men have!  I always thought that in most jobs no-one was indispensable.  Anyway let them go, must be others who can replace them.

Martine Guy ● 412d

Ivonne, is that a typo?  Did you mean MOTD?  Anyway I’d love to see an older Japanese woman present the programme, got to be more entertaining than boring Lineker.

Martine Guy ● 412d

Even I saw the relevance of that article and I have a life outside of this forum or constant replies of the same names that pop up in 80% of these threads.

Thomas Jones ● 412d

The new presenter for MPTD has been announced:

Ivonne Holliday ● 412d

I guess it gives both sides' lawyers time to analyse whether what he said was technically correct, what the BBC's rules really are and whether they've been applied consistently; for example,  withright wing commentators like Andrew Neil? 

Michael Ixer ● 412d

They should try out a new presenter every week, let the public choose a replacement for overpaid, boring, Lineker.  I would like to see a woman given a chance to present MOTD. 

Martine Guy ● 412d

Apologies, I am posting this again but changed the title of the posting.Breaking news on the BBC:Gary Lineker is to step back from presenting Match of the Day until an agreement is reached on his social media use, the BBC has said.Only his?  Nobody else?  If the BBC has rules, it should be very clear to all and apply to all its employees or to specific groups of employees.  Not just one person.

Ivonne Holliday ● 412d

Breaking news on the BBC:Gary Lineker is to step back from presenting Match of the Day until an agreement is reached on his social media use, the BBC has said.Only his?  Nobody else?  If the BBC has rules, it should be very clear to all and apply to all its employees or to specific groups of employees.  Not just one person.

Ivonne Holliday ● 412d

At least we can still watch the BBC's UK deforestation documentary.On the subject of displacement and refugees an interesting article with the 100m number:Miliband: “100 million Displaced represent 100 million reasons for change”The Chagos Islands are not listed - can't think why!https://www.rescue.org/press-release/miliband-100-million-displaced-represent-100-million-reasons-changehttps://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/david-miliband-rushed-in-chagos-islands-protection-order-9776069.html

Ed Robinson ● 412d

This is beyond unforgivable, it is verging on criminality.  How can nature programmes dealing with enormous problems as we have today:  climate change, pollution, etc. be censored by government Ministers!!!  Such king rats!!!I will certainly make a point of watching the programmes on iPlayer.

Ivonne Holliday ● 412d

Following on from the criticism of Let for a personal tweet he made outside of his BBC work do we now have the BBC being effectively censored for fear of upsetting right wing opinion? Surely scientific information should be published and then its veracity debated? https://www.theguardian.com/media/2023/mar/10/david-attenborough-bbc-wild-isles-episode-rightwing-backlash-fears

Michael Ixer ● 412d

"More inflammatory comments from Suella Braverman.  Should Govt Ministers be escalating an already delicate situation?"Recent aggregated polls show Labour projected to get 368 seats in an election and the Tories projected to get 186 seats.Escalation is their only hope at the moment. So they will gamble on it.

David Ainsworth ● 413d

'then we will be left with GBNEWS' Quite right David  We do deserve it  Truth and no lies. And journalists and reporters who give unbiased facts After all the lies and bias from the BBC I am truly grateful

Barbara Shillabeer ● 413d

And there have been people who have been deported from the UK to Jamaica who have been murdered in Jamaica.

David Ainsworth ● 413d

More inflammatory comments from Suella Braverman.  Should Govt Ministers be escalating an already delicate situation?

Philippa Bond ● 413d

I am sorry John Lambert, but your response does not make any sense whatsoever.You say Lineker has blood in his hands. I do not know why, as far as I am aware, he has not killed anybody.However, according to your line of thinking, what about the young people being stabbed to death in the UK by UK nationals?

Ivonne Holliday ● 413d

But the WEF did get a mention at the Tech Show (ExCel) today during a presentation on Cyber security by one of the ISF members. Sadly, no mention of 5G chips, vaccines or Bill Gates - unfortunate as some would say Windows structure might be why we have so many cyber sec infrastructure problems ... (Sorry about picture quality but I was standing at the back.)

Michael Ixer ● 413d

Just provide one bit of evidence for the claim 'Lineker has called for open borders' please.

Matt Palmer ● 413d

What's the relevance of that article, I can't find any mention of Leneker in it? Poor references as usual!i

Michael Ixer ● 413d

Lineker keeps calling for open borders and calls for letting everyone in without papers.So when one of these criminals murders another human being the woke brigade need to be held accountable. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11799331/MPs-lead-anger-blocked-deportation-Jamaican-criminal-later-committed-murder.html

John Lambert ● 413d

News competition is generally a good thing.I remember Channel 4 launching and making a huge difference as did Sky News.In the meantime BBC TV News has deteriorated and you tend to see the same faces on programmes like Question Time again and again.I have watched GB news once or twice so I may not be describing it accurately. Is it not more of a news talk show channel & not a news channel?With lots of uTube like news channels, it is difficult to see how they will survive based on their current finance model.

Ed Robinson ● 413d

Interesting that GB News is losing money. Perhaps it's to do with the poor calibre of their presenters?https://www.theguardian.com/media/2023/mar/09/losses-deepen-at-gb-news-network-moves-to-fend-off-rival-talktv-nigel-farage-jacob-rees-mogg-#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=16783719702213&csi=0&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fmedia%2F2023%2Fmar%2F09%2Flosses-deepen-at-gb-news-network-moves-to-fend-off-rival-talktv-nigel-farage-jacob-rees-mogg-

Michael Ixer ● 413d

Ha, ha, Ivonne. Another great cartoon from Matt. Of course whether one agrees with Lineker or not, and I think some of the government statements are somewhat inflammatory, it a good way of distracting llthfocus away from a collapsing heath and care service and a failing economy. 

Michael Ixer ● 413d

I don't like slimeball, Lineker, and his comments have made him look bad in the eyes of many, and he's helped further tarnish the image of the corrupt and disgraceful BBC, so not a bad outcome really..

Michael Brown ● 413d

Good one. Although perhaps "Gaol of the Month" might appeal more to Braverman.

David Ainsworth ● 413d

Ivonne Holliday ● 413d

I absolutely agree with Lineker's overall comment that Braverman/Sunak's proposed law is beyond awful, but did feel he left a bit of an open goal (sorry!) in the comparison with Germany. By saying that the language being used "is not dissimilar to that used by Germany in the 30s" (which is entirely accurate if referring to the earlier part of that time), he left it open for opponents to say that he was comparing the proposed law with Nazi Germany - or even, according to one overheated commenter on LBC, with the Holocaust.

Richard Carter ● 413d

Last night I was watching the papers review on Sky News (the BBC no longer does this!).The reviewers were Kevin Maguire, associate editor at the Daily Mirror, and Annabel Denham, deputy comment editor at The Telegraph.The bright button of Annabel Denham said that Gary Lineker was made famous by the BBC and he was repaying them very badly!!  ???????

Ivonne Holliday ● 413d

My understanding is that both the BBC UK (not offshore) broadcast services & GB News are subject to the same Ofcom rules.Both have had failings.Twitter is a private company and can have its own policy.Although recent revelations regarding US state interference may change that but that is some way off.I think the BBC/GB news discussion is really irrelevant.As far as I'm aware Lineker has not taken any political party's  side. The Labour view is very close to the Conservatives anyway. In fact Emily Thornberry said that Lineker went too far.

Ed Robinson ● 413d

The solution obvious. Lineker moves from the BBC to GB News to balance e their right wing bias? And the director general of the BBC resigns because of his corrupt appointment process :-)

Michael Ixer ● 413d

"He is subject to impartiality rules"Show me.

David Ainsworth ● 413d

"the demise of this corrupt organisation will just happen even quicker than it is already."Then we will be left with GBNews. And we shall deserve it.

David Ainsworth ● 413d

John Lambert, are you feeling OK?  You say "Lineker has blood on his hands" - I am sorry!!!!!! Could you explain yourself coherently, please.  Thank you.

Ivonne Holliday ● 413d

It's time Lineker was sacked. He is subject to impartiality rules and he is completely ignoring this.The BBC need to come down hard on him or otherwise the demise of this corrupt organisation will just happen even quicker than it is already.Lineker has blood on his hands.https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11811979/Parents-man-murdered-Jamaican-criminal-slam-celebs-spoke-help-block-deportation.html

John Lambert ● 414d

Precisely, David, and it's a free country, isn't it. Just think of the biased stuff spouted on GB News!

Michael Ixer ● 414d

They need a distraction from their BBC chairman Richard Sharp, longterm Tory donor.

David Ainsworth ● 414d

First they came for the football commentators. But I did not speak, because I can't stand football.

Michael Winstanley ● 414d

And it was done on his personal Twitter account.

David Ainsworth ● 414d

Odd that the Daily Mail etc are so against 'cancel culture' and yet seem to be determined to silence someone giving a personal opinion.

Matt Palmer ● 414d

No wonder there's been a push to avoid teaching history.  History can repeat itself.

Philippa Bond ● 414d