Forum Topic

Petition requesting the Government for inquiry into [ the much needed] impact of Brexit

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/628226?fbclid=IwAR1fYOJBmZbrUD20wEIB7AP2xPLg4VQfiY0-Na8RuyE7_joSADXjrzfIhWU

Ivonne Holliday ● 923d39 Comments

Yes, I've lost where this was going. I can't see any commonality between Brexit and the Ukraine war, I don't recall it being suggested there was. Brexit was a legal referendum that ended up with the UK negotiating a bad deal; the Ukraine war is an illegal military attack on one sovereign country by another? Did I miss something?

Michael Ixer ● 909d

I agree, closing trading with the EU made no sense whatsoever.  It has been - and will continue to be - a travesty of common sense.The only link I can see between Brexit and Ukraine is that both were and are UK government policies.  But independent from each other.

Ivonne Holliday ● 910d

"in the same way that Eastern European nations were accepted as members on 1 May 2004"Taking Estonia as an example which joined in 2004 it applied in 1995 that's a 9 year journey.The timelines from candidate status to membership will vary but unfortunately much of the concerns around Turkey are also relevant to Ukraine. Of course EU standards and rules can be bent backwards when politically convient as we saw when serveral countries joined the Euro that clearly did not meet the criteria.Brexit is a disaster for UK trade especially exports. (From memory) Germany previously exported twice the amount the UK did to India and three times the amount to China.New markets some said preBrexit: What new markets? It makes no sense when it comes to trade if we are just going to follow US interests and can not take full advantage of growing economies.Post Brexit we did not even remove VAT on insulation.However I see no link with Brexit & Ukraine. The UK's foreign policy would have been the same without Brexit.

Ed Robinson ● 910d

I am a bit confused about this.Brexit was never a declaration of war - just self-destruction.Of course that Ukraine's application for membership has been accepted by the EU, in the same way that the Eastern European nations were accepted as members on 1 May 2004 which ended the division of Europe after WWII.Turkey, on the other hand, is a completely different kettle of fish in more ways than one and cannot be compared to Ukraine.But, to say that UK's current woes are only due to the energy crisis and Ukraine is not only preposterous but a convenient political lie by some.  Brexit is the root of many of UK's woes that have been exacerbated by the energy crisis, the Ukraine war plus very empty coffers.

Ivonne Holliday ● 910d

Neither have anything to do with Brexit.What if UK casualties are reported?Sadly there is speculation that recent announcements may be a way of preparation for such event. Let's hope not.Would UK soldiers have died for Brexit?It really is a nonsense road to go down as well as distasteful.The article also doesn't make clear the fact that the EU has only accepted Ukraine's application to join and has not accepted Ukraine as a member. They also accepted Turkey's application many years ago. But again this is nothing to do with Brexit.This is a bad article and the author is doing Ukraine no favours in mixing up Brexit and the war as a means of dividing Ukraine's allies.

Ed Robinson ● 910d

The Ukraine applied for EU membership and the deaths are a result of Putin's invasion. 

Michael Ixer ● 910d

Dead bodies are never a good way to make cheap political point.You certainly wouldn't want the author of the article on your team trying to persuade people about the EU.

Ed Robinson ● 910d

Ed. Not sure, but I thought the reference to Ukraine was just to show a desire of Ukrainians to be part of the European family rather than the Russian Federation (which may not be true of all Ukrainians) and to show that that the EU had a broader interest politically rather than being just an economic union? I think the Irish Republic will have an interest in supporting the GFA and the EU will find it expedient to support their side. EU membership was an easy way for the UK and Ireland to create a "fudge" in which the GFA worked.

Michael Ixer ● 910d

Yes Michael good points and I agreed with some of what he had to say. Labour's position at the election and Labour voting for the deal instead of abstaining, which they had became good at, closed the doors to having a sensible discussion going forward.But then it descends into some very odd territory. It implies that Brexit has got something to do with Ukraine which is a complete nonsense.Right or wrong, acknowledgment of British troops on the ground in Ukraine says more about the UK commitment that the authors ramblings.I can only assume that some of it was meant for an EU audience.Let's hope the EU continue to support the GFA, Merkel recent revelations about the Minsk agreement does make you wonder about politicians having little respect for what they sign.

Ed Robinson ● 911d

Interesting, although I did read before that the French school trips to the UK had been curtailed because parents didn't want to shell out for passports for their kids.https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-hampshire-63984360#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=16712976605749&csi=0&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.bbc.com%2Fnews%2Fuk-england-hampshire-63984360

Michael Ixer ● 911d

Possibly, Ed, although I was interested in that it reflected my views and that of a number of other people I know. The problem isn't necessarily Brexit per se but that it's a rushed, bad and incomplete Brexit. Switzerland, Norway and Iceland chug along ok without being in the EU (as did the Channel Islands) but they are more realistic about their relationship with the EU without any extreme ideology getting in its way. Of course, Norway was sensible and put its oil money into a sovereign fund for a rainy day :-)

Michael Ixer ● 911d

It looks like article that is trying to use Brexit to distract from other issues.There are plenty of articles that give an European view without doing so.

Ed Robinson ● 911d

A European view on Brexit …https://uk.news.yahoo.com/voices-brexit-elephant-room-british-110503458.html

Michael Ixer ● 911d

JRM's aim was to avoid ATAD at all costs.In this sense, Brexit was successful for him - and very few others.Anything else does not count.

Ivonne Holliday ● 911d

The short answer is that people tend to believe lies that confirm their own preferences, be it Brexit or Remain.Brexit did not occur because of JRM lies and could have been avoided had the UK had a proper constitution that would have required the public to be consulted when giving up sovereignty.It also could have been avoided if various parties did not a low wage model for the UK.Nothing has changed on either of these issues but yes let's all just point the finger at JRM and all will be fine! It won't until we tackle the real causes if Brexit.

Ed Robinson ● 911d

Is anyone still gullible to believe the lies of JRM and others who promoted Brexit?

Michael Ixer ● 911d

Interesting non-response here:https://www.thenational.scot/news/23195012.jacob-rees-mogg-stuns-question-time-viewers-brexit-trade-denial/

Philippa Bond ● 911d

Ms Holliday,Why should there be a Government inquiry over this issue and not over every other issue pursued by this and other recent Governments ?If people have concerns they should express them by voting against a Conservative government at the next election and for the opposition Labour Party, which if it is so strongly against what has happened will put in its manifesto a commitment to reverse the situation by applying to re-join the EU.

John Hawkes ● 918d

Well obviously the Conservatives aren't going to do it & Starmer dare not do it because he needs the traditional Labour voters to turn out for him to get elected next time then it's not going to happen. You could always move to Scotland or better still the EU I suppose.

Paul Rolink ● 919d

Nicked from Facebook, someone's thought of a Brexit benefit: "I have finally thought of a Brexit benefit - it's making increasing numbers of people appreciate just how valuable our EU membership was!"

Michael Ixer ● 920d

"Brexit can no more fail than any other country governing itself outside the EU."There is very little point of Brexit if you are just going to blindly follow US foreign policy - which is designed to protect the US economy.Perhaps you can name some of these other countries?

Ed Robinson ● 920d

Thank you Richard and Michael for these postings.I was wondering, did somebody once say that silence is golden?

Ivonne Holliday ● 921d

Easier to view options
https://www.flickr.com/gp/m-j-i/9T7UFt0hCphttps://www.flickr.com/gp/m-j-i/C5kKK13m9x

Michael Ixer ● 921d

Richard Carter ● 921d

Let's cut to the chase.  "Brexit is" SELF-HARM.  "Brexit is" PURE FOLLY. "Brexit is" A FAILURE.

Alexander MacLeod ● 921d

So, if Brexit hasn't failed, why is  there no working government in Northern Ireland? Where's all that money that the big bus promised for the NHS? 

Michael Ixer ● 921d

What is FBPE please?"Brexit is not an economic policy. It is simply an act of a nation self determining it's own laws.It is an attempt to constitutional democratic self governance."I think you should go back and study the whole issue of Brexit carefully.  Just to give you a little hand.  Brexit is the withdrawal of the UK from the EU.The UK is the only SOVEREIGN country to have left the EU or the EC.

Ivonne Holliday ● 921d

The sane old lies are constantly being peddled by some people who want to overturn Brexit. Brexit is not an economic policy. It is simply an act of a nation self determining it's own laws. It is an attempt to constitutional democratic self governance.Brexit can no more fail than any other country governing itself outside the EU.It is clear the FBPE crowd want the country and Brexit to fail.

John Lambert ● 921d

the Brexit debacle aside, 100'000 signatures is far too few for a parliamentary debate for any issue. If a petition cant get at least 1% of the population backing it, it clearly doesn't matter very much to the wider population

Adam Tripp ● 922d

Precisely, Michael!!

Ivonne Holliday ● 922d

I agree, it will take some doing to out class BoJo...Still, the current lot seem to be following suit.And, no, I do not think that the opposition take the trophy for telling lies.

Ivonne Holliday ● 922d

Michael Ixer ● 922d

"Debating it would be a pointless exercise. Even Starmer has changed his tune.""Those are my tunes, and if you don't like them... well, I can play other ones." (Whistlin' Keir Starmer, I think)

David Ainsworth ● 922d

"Is this debate a waste of time?  Well, more than likely, but the more they lie, the worse the outcome at the next election will be....."The best liar will win, I guess. Any bets?

David Ainsworth ● 922d

Yes, Sue, that is what they were bound to reply when the petition reached, I think, 10 signatures.If it reaches 100,000 signatures (yours, by the way, has exceeded 150,000), the petition must be debated.Is this debate a waste of time?  Well, more than likely, but the more they lie, the worse the outcome at the next election will be.....

Ivonne Holliday ● 922d

Both main parties think that they can make a go of it.Perhaps they have insight we do not have?Meanwhile I suspect emigration figures will increase with housing costs/crime being high, low wages and deteriorating services - younger people will vote with their feet.On the plus side neither of the main parties are likely to upset older established homeowners who they see as their key target votes.

Ed Robinson ● 922d

Debating it would be a pointless exercise. Even Starmer has changed his tune.

Sue Hammond ● 922d

Yes, the government knows Brexit is a failure and don't want to admit it. 

Michael Ixer ● 923d

Non-starter."Government respondedThis response was given on 5 December 2022The UK’s departure from the EU was a democratic choice and the UK-EU institutions are functioning as intended. The Government does not believe this to be an appropriate subject for a public inquiry."

Sue Hammond ● 923d