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Sue, I think you're confusing/conflating two things here: (1) in classifying the cause of death in the pandemic it's possible to make errors, and (2) that this is being done deliberately in support of some great conspiracy on the public, usually by giant lizards or whatever else the fantasists are wont to believe.I accept the first of these: it depends on the interpretation of the data, specifically on the cause of death - for example, did the person die *from* or *with* Covid? A better estimate of the effects of Covid can be gained from studies of excess mortality (the number of deaths from all causes during a crisis above and beyond what we would have expected to see under ‘normal’ conditions): and this paper in the Lancet (https://doi.org/10.1016/S0140-6736(21)02796-3) sets out the results, concluding that: “Although reported COVID-19 deaths between Jan 1, 2020, and Dec 31, 2021, totalled 5·94 million worldwide, we estimate that 18·2 million (95% uncertainty interval 17·1–19·6) people died worldwide because of the COVID-19 pandemic (as measured by excess mortality) over that period.”It’s point (2) I was describing as silly (and that’s putting it much more politely than it deserves). Are we supposed to believe that governments all over the world are deliberately misclassifying deaths? And for what purpose? There is, let’s be clear, absolutely no evidence for this phantasm; you have to be living at the flat earth end of the spectrum to take that nonsense even halfway seriously.

Richard Carter ● 1455d

@Sue. I've never been sure that the lockdowns were to stop deaths rather than to alleviate pressure on the health service to stop it from collapsing because of the years of underinvestment by several Tory governments - after all, if you're dead you're not hogging a bed or using other NHS resources; or am I being to cynical?In practice deaths were recorded for several reasons: (1) those who just died of Covid (I think the minority?); (2) people who had Covid which then created a secondary condition such as lung disease or blood clots which finally killed them so Covid was co-listed with those; (3) those with underlying conditions - for example, diabetes, hypertension, etc - who caught Covid and we're unable to fight off Covid because of their underlying condition weakening their immune system so they would have been recorded as a comorbidity with Covid; and (4) those who, like a friend of mine, were admitted to hospital with a heart attack or as some other medical or accident emergency, survived that, had additional treatment (my friend had a stent fitted), then caught Covid while recovering in hospital - again an immune system already overtaxed meant they died like my friend so Covid and another condition such as a heart attack were probably recorded. I'm sure errors were made in recording deaths but all measurements have error tolerances - I'm sure they'll be worked out one day (!) - but I think one can say there were a significant number of premature deaths caused by Covid.

Michael Ixer ● 1455d