Forum Topic

"I've no particular issue with what XR are campaigning for"Animal Rebellion have 3 aims. 1) Tell the truth: Government and big business must tell the truth by declaring animal agriculture to be a leading cause of the climate and ecological emergency.Seems fair enough. Various stats are on the government's webpages illustrating the above.2) Act now: Government and big business must act now to transition to a plant-based food system in order to halt biodiversity loss and reduce greenhouse gas emissions to net zero by 2025.That is 2 years and 8 months away.I can't see how that can be done without a mass culling of live stock not to mention pets that are also dependent on that industry.3) Beyond politics: Government must create and be led by the decisions of a Citizens’ Assembly on climate and ecological justice.After 2) above I can't see there be many volunteers for this.Given the timescales and the extent of animal agriculture for human and animal consumption - measures such as stop the breeding of animals will be insufficient. Overall UK dairy cows are down year after year although the numbers in Wales and NI show a slight increase."The total number of UK dairy cows has fallen from 2.6 million in 1996 to 1.9 million in 2020, a 28% reduction."Given that dairy cows are normally permitted to live less than 6 years that is still a lot of cows. No doubt the same with sheep. Pigs and chickens are much younger so probably not an issue.Oldly enough I wouldn't have an issue if that was the democratic consensus. But I'm not a pet person and I do not need to be to appreciate that many people are for a variety of reasons. Good for them.What I would have an issue with is being asked to give up meat and having a freezer full of raw pet food!I'm not quite sure the animal supporters who are often pet owners have thought this through.The fact that there is no mention of pets is perhaps an indication that they have purposely ignored such issues.When will they tell them I wonder?

Ed Robinson ● 1387d

I can't speak for XR or any other organisations but it is another conundrum; modern life is complex and we have to start change from the current state … as I indicated in an earlier post I'm pragmatic about these things, and more interested in change through education and persuasion. There are conflicts between pet ownership and veganism. There's the purist argument that owning pets for human pleasure is exploitation of animals so against the vegan philosophy. Definitely a case for some pragmatism: given the number of animals needing rescue homes it's surely better for one of these to be looked after by a vegan (or veggie) who cares about animal welfare? If one looks at the issue of what they eat: firstly, dogs can live happily on a vegan diet provided it's properly balanced (I know at least one and I know there are many others); secondly, cats do need meat so it would be unhealthy for them not to have a carnivorous diet, and at present there's no shortage of waste products from the food industry so cat ownership isn't sustaining the meat industry while most humans are carnivorous. (There is vegan cat food which has the required additives needed for a healthy feline diet but I'm not sure it's kind to feed cats on it.)I'm not sure a comparison of veganism and green energy are valid although being vegan certainly assists alleviating the climate emergency. One can be vegan relatively easily by not buying non vegan products and selecting vegan options in restaurants. (They need to accommodate allergies and lactose intolerance anyway.) Consumer pressure means most chain restaurants - even 'spoons pubs - have vegan options; if they didn't they'd rule out group bookings including one or more vegans. Using green energy is more difficult. Ok, at home one can buy energy from, for example, Ecotricity who supply electricity from renewable sources and are seeking to produce gas from plant sources (although I'm not convinced about that but I'm sure Dale Vince has done his sums). However, one has no control over the source of power used by the trains one has to travel on or where an electric Zipcar isccharged (in fact even Zipcar don't when they use public chargers). That can only be driven by government policies - and my understanding is that's what XR are targeting, not individuals who may have little control over the energy they use. Obviously, individuals can make a difference by not flying when greener options are available, or walking or cycling instead of using cars for shorter journeys.

Michael Ixer ● 1387d