Forum Topic

ULEZ plan to extend to whole of Greater London

The mayor of London has announced plans to extend the Ultra Low Emission Zone (ULEZ) across the whole of London.Under the current scheme, drivers of older, more polluting vehicles are being charged to enter London's north and south-circular orbital roads.New proposals will see the scheme extend to the edges of London's boroughs in 2023.https://bit.ly/35sdkZO?fbclid=IwAR31ieuARuR6JL4PXUtZf5rXyDRvoxu4HAqRoIKh4G0TcVaolmq6LIocmyM

Freddie Francis ● 1431d38 Comments

https://twitter.com/copenhenken/status/1499663955282862085

Matt Palmer ● 1429d

Richard obviously didn't like any of my ten points.

Ed Robinson ● 1429d

Ivonne, Yes, you're right: I was so distracted by that asinine comment by Michael Winstanley that I quite missed referring to your and Michael Ixer's responses. My apologies!

Richard Carter ● 1429d

Good morning Richard,I am surprised!  You asked the same question in another thread a month or so ago and I did answer.  Did not see the need to repeat myself.Perhaps saying in this thread would be clearer?

Ivonne Holliday ● 1429d

Well Richard, perhaps you could design a Fred Flintstone Vehicle. Lots have spent thousands on a new Vehicle, your still not satisfied. Love to know how much sh=t your old Vehicle is sending out into the Universe.

Barbara Stevens ● 1429d

On 04/02 I posted this:"It's *so* easy to snipe mindlessly from the sidelines, isn't it? But given that (1) there are an estimated 9,400 premature deaths from pollution each year in London alone and (2) we face devastating effects of global heating - both of which are caused in large part by vehicle emissions, what would the "experts" here suggest is done?"So far, Michael Winstanley's unfunny suggestion is the only one. I'm not surprised.

Richard Carter ● 1430d

Yes that's a good point. The same daily charge should also be levied on owners of dogs, cats and parrots (unless they are of a hairless variety). That would raise more revenue too.

Michael Winstanley ● 1430d

Apologies Michael - new reading glasses are definitely needed or a bigger phone.

Ed Robinson ● 1430d

Asthma can be brought on by stress, also Dog and Cat hair and parrots, I expect there are lists other than exhaust fumes.

Barbara Stevens ● 1430d

??? Ed. I made no comment about NOX ... (-)

Michael Ixer ● 1430d

Michael it is not even real world NOx.If you look at the True Initiative there are huge differences.https://www.trueinitiative.org/

Ed Robinson ● 1430d

I could not find any ULEZ figures for January. Expected revenue was down last year.It is difficult to have a positive opinion of the scheme that has under delivered on air quality when we do not know the revenue it is generating.Having a road map like the Oxford scheme - saying what vehicles would be included going forward would have prevented him from being boxed in on the pricing structure for the next four years. Instead they have been telling everyone that ULEZ compliance is the same as clean air which is just nonsense.Production of domestic non-specialist ICE cars will probably cease in under 4 years with drastic falls before that. Of course ICE cars will be around a log time after that but revenue predictions should be very cautious.The cost of the infrastructure for the ULEZ expansion without a road map on tariffs and based on the current two tier system is either foolish or misleading.

Ed Robinson ● 1430d

This is a farce and, due to the scale of the expansion of this unpopular and unfair 'initiative', is discriminating against captive residents in less well off areas. Khan is hiding behind an altruistic smokescreen to justify fleecing drivers to compensate for his mismanagement of TfL. I grew up in rural Australia with chronic asthma - which just goes to show you can't blame traffic for all cases. Sure, air quality is important but I've only seen more congestion as a result of ULEZ being introduced. How long before Khan taxes us to breathe the cleaner air he claims this will produce?

Roy Robart ● 1430d

@Vic - CO2 is not what ULEZ limits are based on. It’s particulates and NOx.

Freddie Francis ● 1430d

The Classification of ULEZ is a Joke.Petrol Vehicles spew out nearly double the CO2 that most Diesels do. THAT is the cause of so called Climate Change & don’t even go there with EV’s!( Electric Vehicles) they are NOT Zero Emission, It’s just the Pollution ends up at another place, the Wood Pellet burning Power Station!The whole thing is a Farce!Let’s get Frackin’👍

Vic Condon ● 1430d

"Did they also discover that the Pope is a catholic? "Perhaps a confession or two is in order as I seem to remember Labour posters saying: "ULEZ is coming to Putney it's time to say goodbye to toxic exhaust emissions"

Ed Robinson ● 1431d

"They also found that the biggest improvements in air quality in fact took place before the ULEZ was introduced in 2019."Well, of course they did, because that was when TfL introduced hybrid buses. Did they also discover that the Pope is a catholic?

Richard Carter ● 1431d

Very interesting article here - just targeting old vehicles isn't enough but they have dug a hole for themselves with the two tier pricing structure and are now digging deeper!"They found that, compared to the overall decrease in London's air pollution levels, the ULEZ caused only small improvements in air quality: an average reduction of less than 3 percent for nitrogen dioxide concentrations, and insignificant effects on ozone and particulate matter (PM2.5) concentrations.They also found that the biggest improvements in air quality in fact took place before the ULEZ was introduced in 2019."https://phys.org/news/2021-11-london-pollution-ulez-small-effect.html#:~:text=They%20found%20that%2C%20compared%20to,5)%20concentrations.

Ed Robinson ● 1431d

If only he and his union pals could keep the trains running.

Andy Pike ● 1431d

Richard yes Oxford ULEZ trial has only been running for a couple of days.But if you look at the pricing structure it makes a lot of sense. It's a scaled structure depending upon the level of pollution.

Ed Robinson ● 1431d

It probably took a whole 2 minutes for our misguided and ineffective Mayor to come up with this 'plan' during one of his many freebie eventshttps://www.london.gov.uk/people/mayoral/sadiq-khan/gifts-hospitality

Jo Amadi ● 1431d

"Installing so many cycle lanes ... creates more pollution." You've just repeated one of the great traffic myths: for example, a study by Imperial College found that "while [Cycle Superhighways] somewhat reduced traffic flow – the number of vehicles passing by in a certain time frame – they improved traffic speed, meaning overall there was little impact on congestion."https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/219093/no-evidence-that-londons-cycle-superhighways/; the full study, submitted to the Annals of Applied Statistics, can be downloaded here: https://www.e-publications.org/ims/submission/AOAS/user/submissionFile/49271?confirm=d770989cMeanwhile, I'm sure it's not entirely a coincidence that you haven't suggested anything to tackle either the health effects of pollution or the effects on our planet of global heating.

Richard Carter ● 1431d

... to afford to run internal combustion engine (ICE) cars. I was being flippant, Sue :-)

Michael Ixer ● 1431d

@Michael Eh??

Sue Hammond ● 1431d

Hi Richard. Yes the premature deaths from toxic pollution are indeed shocking but TFL's methods are making pollution in many areas even worse. Installing so many cycle lanes, thus reducing vehicular lanes, is impacting traffic flow which results in more idling traffic, which in turn creates more pollution ...

Sue Hammond ● 1431d

Perhaps Khan thinks he's Putin, if he tries hard enough we will all leave London, who will he have to control then.

Barbara Stevens ● 1431d

Oh go on please

Andy Pike ● 1431d

Anyway, thanks to my Putin, oil based fuels will become so expensive soon you won't be able to afford t run ICE cars …

Michael Ixer ● 1431d

Sue. I there's some doubt about whether he actually said that, although it's certainly a traditional physicist's view. Circa three years ago I was talking to a physicist working on a collaborative venture with biologists who'd had to review their thoughts on that, and I think quantum physicists also have a different view :-)

Michael Ixer ● 1431d

It's *so* easy to snipe mindlessly from the sidelines, isn't it? But given that (1) there are an estimated 9,400 premature deaths from pollution each year in London alone and (2) we face devastating effects of global heating - both of which are caused in large part by vehicle emissions, what would the "experts" here suggest is done?I won't hold my breath in waiting for your positive ideas.

Richard Carter ● 1431d

Sue Hammond ● 1431d

Agree entirely! It was obvious he was paying out Millions to start ULEZ,  But it would only be Diminishing Returns! He is now making the same Mistake again!( And Bankrupting London)

Vic Condon ● 1431d

Do wish Khan would polish up his English."Those in outer London die more"Thought you could only die once.

Andy Pike ● 1431d

Yes, careful; someone could decide to merge the London and Oxford Schemes into a south east England ULEZ. No problem for those of us who don't own cars.

Michael Ixer ● 1431d

"They really need to look at Oxford ULEZ trial."Somewhat premature to judge, don't you think, given that it's been running for only 4 days!https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-10560311/Oxford-Zero-Emission-Zone-launches-TODAY-charging-drivers-10-day.html

Richard Carter ● 1431d

Khan admit he was wrong? Dream on!!

Sue Hammond ● 1431d

They really need to look at Oxford ULEZ trial.The number of old car is falling all the time, it will never pay back the costs of the infrastructure. Money that would be better spent on real transport infrastructure. Not to mention the time to install and get up and running.Change the pricing structure of the current ULEZ first before expanding.Will require the Mayor to admit they got it wrong but pretending it's right and believing their own propaganda will cost us all more.

Ed Robinson ● 1431d

Not surprised. The incompetent little fart with a huge ego needs even more money to employ even more highly paid staff to make him feel even more important."Transport for London (TfL) had by far the highest number of staff receiving over £100,000, with 518. Of these, 114 received more than £150,000 last year. The highest remunerated employee, TfL boss Michael Brown, received £508,301 in total remuneration, including taking home the biggest bonus of £133,586. The largest expense claim was by the managing director of London Underground who received £16,385, including reimbursement of travel expenses."Over 500 TfL staff earned more than £100,000 despite £1.6bn taxpayer bailout - TaxPayers' Alliancehttps://www.taxpayersalliance.com/over_500_tfl_staff_earned_more_than_100_000_despite_1_6bn_taxpayer_bailout

Sue Hammond ● 1431d