Forum Topic

This is really ridiculous!

Boris Johnson has "categorically" denied he was warned a drinks party in the No 10 garden risked breaking lockdown rules.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60039868

Ivonne Holliday ● 1244d35 Comments

I have to disagree.The US was/is subsidising Europe on military spending.The US does not have universal health care and it is really shameful that we expect US citizens to foot the bill for European security.Even with Afghanistan the expectation was that US troops should provide security where the UK was not willing.I have to say that I'm not a fan of the Afghan war and associated atrocities carried out by the UK, allied forces along with the Afghan war lords which we supported.

Ed Robinson ● 1239d

Michael, looking at the %gdp you can see the differences.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures

Ed Robinson ● 1240d

I seem to recall Trump weakened Europe with his negative attitude towards NATO and the EU while seemingly making overtures yowards Putin? Trump then weakened the US trying to overthrow the presidential election and the ongoing chaos from that. At the same time Europe is distracted with Brexit negotiations including unresolved issues such as the NI protocol. I think Putin's hoping to get what he wants without invading Ukraine but the situation is volatile, one inadvertent move and it could kick off. There is the possibility that Putin might consider a cyber attack rather than risk unpopularity at home from what could be significant casualties if he did invade Ukraine ... we still don't know what intelligence Russia has stolen from US agencies following the Solar Winds and MS Exchange compromises last year ... lots of uncertainties ...

Michael Ixer ● 1240d

Ed. Hasn't China invested heavily in defence as well as R&D and infrastructure.  Sometimes there's a heavy overlap, as in space developments?

Michael Ixer ● 1240d

"..we seem to be on the brink of a very unstable global situation?"I guess that would be defence spending. It's interesting that countries with high defence spending have declined while those that have invested in infrastructure and r&d have prospered.

Ed Robinson ● 1240d

Putin hasn't weakened the US & Europe. The US has weakened itself. Just look at Biden. The EU is useless. It couldn't make it's mind up quick enough & is as divided as always. Funnily enough but not over brexit but that makes them look united, but that's another story. He just hovers around the fringes trying to make mischief when he can.Look at him with the gas situation. Taking advantage again.You can see his weakness. He is still digging stuff up out of the ground while all the other advanced economies have had an industrial revolution.He tries to make himself look big on the world stage. He isn't going to invade Ukraine or risk war with Nato.Britain is the only country supplying weapons to Ukraine. Where are the EU? Johnson did that. Still bitter about brexit then. Even worse if he does go there's no going back now.

Paul Rolink ● 1240d

To be honest  Ed. I'm not sure why there is a war in Yemen. I'm sure it must be a hangover from ISIS terrorism somewhere or the Iraqi war, but to my shame I've lost track. I'm sure the reason we're assisting the Saudis must be something to do with the fact thatthey have oil? I'm not sure ethics ever really comes into foreign policy, does it? Sorry to be cynical.I suspect the ramifications of Russia and China rising in ascendancy over Europe and the US would lead to more radical changes that I can't see will be for the best ...I'm honestly not sure, but we seem to be on the brink of a very unstable global situation?

Michael Ixer ● 1240d

If only the UK had a ethical foreign policy we could call them out. Sadly we do not.I'm more concerned with the UK war in Yemen.Of course there are the arms sales but if we are training Saudi pilots in UK airspace and have UK military in SA and Yemen then that really puts us at war does ir not?Swap the countries names around apply the same rules - it's just double standards.Now should we be at war in Yemen? That is a different question but at least there should be transparency and honesty about it.

Ed Robinson ● 1240d

I agree with you!Seems Putin is succeeding in many fronts without moving a finger, except of course, at the moment, in the Ukraine border and "helping" Belarus re-establish order.....

Ivonne Holliday ● 1240d

It's sad. Particularly when there's the crisisd brewing in Ukraine. Full marks to Putin: he's weakened both Europe and the US. Sanctions are unlikely to work as Europe is dependent on Russia for gas and if the US were to cut Russia off from transacting dollars on the SWIFT payments system I understand that Russia and China now have developed systems that allow them to circumvent SWIFT so they might curtain US power over money markets. (I'll be honest, I've nor verified how accurate those reports are.) Johnson parties while Europe burns? Or freezes if it doesn't get Russian gas!

Michael Ixer ● 1240d

Ha ha ha!!!  Brilliant, thank you!!Rather tragic as well, don't you think?

Ivonne Holliday ● 1240d

You've gotta laugh, than you Private Eye!

Michael Ixer ● 1240d

""Come on boys and girls" - Give your PM a break"Really? You think that he'll straighten out?

David Ainsworth ● 1240d

"Come on boys and girls" - Give your PM a break

Patrick Barrs ● 1241d

Plausible, Sue, but embarrassing internationally ... but good we have great scientists and the NHS!

Michael Ixer ● 1243d

He began the leaks but has become emboldened by the weasels.

Sue Hammond ● 1243d

Cummings isn't "leaking", he seems to be making bold statements about t! There seem to be one ore more other people who are leaking anonymously?

Michael Ixer ● 1243d

Obviously Cummings is the one leaking all this bilge. He was effectively forced out of his job by Carrie, and he now wants revenge on Boris who caved in to her. Of course there were other key figures in the Govt who also hated DC and his influence and they were glad to see the back of him, but are now happy to help him stir the ####.  However Cummings will not succeed in bringing Boris down because with all his faults he is the Party's best bet to win the next GE and none of these weasels want to lose their cushy jobs.

Sue Hammond ● 1243d

Depends on how many. Make examples of the ringleaders?

David Ainsworth ● 1243d

Remember this?  Choose whichever link you prefer:https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/journalists-walk-out-of-no-10-briefing-after-rivals-barred-gg27gsrz5https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/feb/03/political-journalists-boycott-no-10-briefing-after-reporter-banhttps://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/no10-walkout-journalists-lee-cain-trump_uk_5e384359c5b6f262332d9603https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/political-journalists-protest-government-ban-i-publications-no-10-briefings-393679

Ivonne Holliday ● 1243d

And the whip removed?  He would then lose the majority in the HoC?

Ivonne Holliday ● 1243d

A possible scenario on Twitter:-"The letters of no confidence will reach the target, it will go to a vote, he will win, Gray report will come out, no legal investigation from the met, he is safe for another year. don't get your hopes up he's going, he's as safe as f---. It's all in the plan, he has the backing!"An ancient military deception. The feigned retreat (Johnson's feigned weakness?). The over-confident attackers badly damaged and defeated. (And, of course, in this current case, their identities and strength revealed).

David Ainsworth ● 1243d

Was Cummings a reliable source for the BBC or was he only using the BBC for his purposes?  I seem to remember Channel 4 was no longer welcome at No. 10.

Ivonne Holliday ● 1243d

Or once, if it's a 24 hour clock :-)I saw a theory on a FB feed that Cummings survived his eyesight test trip because of fis knowledge of the drinks parties at #10. It would explain why Cummings survived at the time but not why Johnson felt safe in letting him go ...Yes, as you say, let's see the evidence; let's hope it's not heavily redacted by the person who asked Sue Gray to investigate ...

Michael Ixer ● 1244d

"It all reminds me of the three monkeys"Not in this weather.

David Ainsworth ● 1244d

Yes but it also highlights that much of the BBC reporting until the eyesight incident became laughable was just echoing Cummings words.The timings and hence motives are questionable given the close links with the media at the time. Have they been sitting on this story? I believe Julia Hartley-Brewer broke part of the story near the time but didn't have all the details.Even a stopped clock tells the correct time twice a day. Let's see the evidence

Ed Robinson ● 1244d

I don't trust Johnson or Cummings. However, considering it, Cummings has no reason to risk perjuring himself swearing a statement that Johnson was warned about the drinks party being illegal. (It could be spite but it's probably not worth risking perjury for that; Cummings is too calculating to take that risk.) Also, Cummings seems fairly confident there's email evidence to back up his statement; that should be easy for Ms Gray to verify? On the other hand, if Johnson has already been economical with the truth once regarding this matter then he's little to lose trying to keep bluffing it with his version? Just some thoughts?

Michael Ixer ● 1244d

Cummings was considered a reliable source for the BBC at the time, which was before the eye sight incident - I wonder if he mentioned it back then?Perhaps Boris may claim he didn't hear Cummings warning.It all reminds me of the three monkeys (unfortunately not from the band).

Ed Robinson ● 1244d

Sorry Ed, my mistake.  It was breaking news this afternoon and I just checked the article again and it was revised in the last hour.  However, this came I believe after Cummings spoke.

Ivonne Holliday ● 1244d

The article was published on the BBC website an hour ago.  so definitely after Cummings said whatever it is he said.  I cannot stand either men!

Ivonne Holliday ● 1244d

Sorry I've lost rack of the timeline here.Was this before or after the BBC believed everything Dominic Cummings said?

Ed Robinson ● 1244d

@David. If he doesn't know the rules he announced to us all he can't be competent to be in parliament, let alone PM, can he? At one level it's laughable but when one's looking at what's happening in eastern Europe it's scary we haven't got a capable or trustworthy leader :-(

Michael Ixer ● 1244d

I have heard that ignorance of the rules is neither a defence nor an excuse. Now Johnson was quite important and central to making and promulgating these rules, wasn't he? So how could he claim that nobody told him?It is beyond ridiculous. It is kind of pitiful. Am I beginning to feel sorry for him? Is that his aim?

David Ainsworth ● 1244d

And this, a bonus episode of Line of Duty featuring Boris Johnson, is very clever:https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/jed-mercurio-produces-bonus-episode-of-line-of-duty-featuring-boris-johnson-308622/

Richard Carter ● 1244d

Agreed, and similarly as ridiculous as his having spent nearly half an hour at the party that wasn't a party and which he didnt know was a party, without noticing that that was what it was!

Richard Carter ● 1244d