Forum Topic

Dodger uses "a proper investigation" as excuse to hide

"Boris Johnson has dodged a question on whether he attended a party in Downing Street in May 2020 when England was in the first national lockdown.The Sunday Times cited three sources stating Mr Johnson's principal private secretary Martin Reynolds emailed officials with an invite to the event on 20 May suggesting attendees "BYOB" (bring your own bottle, or booze).The newspaper alleged that the PM attended the party in Number 10's garden with his wife, Carrie Johnson.Outdoor gatherings were banned in England at the time under the government's coronavirus rules.When asked by a reporter whether he and his wife attended the event, the PM refused to say.Mr Johnson instead insisted it was a matter for Sue Gray, the senior official leading an investigation into reports of lockdown-busting parties across Whitehall."All that, as you know, is the subject of a proper investigation by Sue Gray," he said."Or Johnson could give a straight answer. He knows the answer.

David Ainsworth ● 1251d55 Comments

Boris won the election partly because the Conservatives were the only party that were seen to respect the referendum.All the other parties decided to ignore the referendum.Big change from 2017 when all parties said they would honour the referendum.Greens and Liberals were opportunists & Labour's motives were internal - trying to keep the party together.Getting Farage on side so that the Brexit vote could be consolidated a key part.

Ed Robinson ● 1248d

I am wondering what action - if any - was taken by the Met Police who are stationed all around Downing St as well as outside the door.  Surely they were aware of all these events in the garden?

Heather Christie ● 1248d

Agreed, Ivonne. Paul seems to show his naivity here. The vaccine rollout was a success because of the skills and organisational infrastructure in the NHS and the MHRA. Credit should also be given to the vaccine development team at Oxford University in the rapid development of the vaccine produced by AZ. From the government's perspective the rollout was lead Nadhim Zahawi, who i think did do an excellent job, and successful purchasing strategy was the work of the vaccines taskforce, set up by chief scientific adviser Patrick Vallance and led by venture capitalist Kate Bingham. (Hancock might get some small credit for that as well for going along with it!) (Quoting from the article below.)Unfortunately if we look at the broader perspective then it's late lockdowns (look at the death statistics), the expensive test and trace fiasco, and the - what has now been deemed illegal by the courts - money wasted on PPE purchases from inappropriate suppliers that are examples of this government's incompetence. I guess if you take the attitude "just throw money at it" then one bit such as vaccines might just struck lucky. An odd attitude by conservatives with business values and a belief in financial disciplines? But then Johnson isn't a business person, has no understanding of discipline and it's not his money so why would he care?Culture is influenced from the top of an organisation. Johnson may have only attended a couple of those social events but given they now seem to have occurred quite regularly one has to believe those organising them in Downing Street thought they were sanctioned by their leadership. In some respects the issue is not the parties (although they are disrespectful to those of us trying to follow the rules) it's the lies and deceit in covering them up which indicates the level of corruption.https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n421

Michael Ixer ● 1248d

Nineteenth century American politician (allegedly):-“Them feller citizens are my principles, but if they don’t suit yer exactly, they ken be altered.”And later allegedly, and similarly, Groucho Marx.

David Ainsworth ● 1248d

it seems to me that some people cherry pick when they believe Boris in order to suit their argument

Adam Tripp ● 1248d

Grow up, Paul!!  In every sense of the word!!What has the referendum got to do with Johnson's partygate, the defence of Owen Paterson, the rebellion of backbenchers, the refurbishment of the flat, suspect contracts issued at the beginning of the pandemic to unsuitable contractors, going to hospitals in the middle of the pandemic without a face covering, his "exemplary negotiations with the EU", the f**k business statement, the prorogation of parliament, the 20,000 extra police officers he promised, Nazanin Zaghari-Radcliffe saga that continues today, to name just a few.By the way, Johnson did not roll out the vaccines, the NHS did, the one and only efficient and effective NHS that he is proposing to privatise through a bill going to parliament next week?Hmmmm, who needs to go out more?

Ivonne Holliday ● 1248d

"He rolled out the vaccines." !!April 14th 2021:-" ... speaking in 10 Downing Street, Mr Johnson suggested the millions of vaccines given over the past few months were NOT key to the reduction in COVID levels.He said: "The numbers are down - of infections and hospitalisations and deaths."But it is very, very important for everybody to understand that the reduction in these numbers - in hospitalisations and in deaths and infections - has not been achieved by the vaccination programme."People don't, I think, appreciate that it's the LOCKDOWN that has been overwhelmingly important in delivering this improvement in the pandemic and in the figures that we're seeing.""it's the lockdown that has been overwhelmingly important" so that's why I say "Party on, dude!"

David Ainsworth ● 1248d

He rolled out the vaccines. Now we are emerging from omicron.The first nation in the world to say we can live with it.Success or what. You can't bear it. And just because you lost a referendum years ago over some deluded enterprise. It has sent you all round the twist. You should get out more.

Paul Rolink ● 1248d

I agree, Yvonne and Michael. His premiership has been a disaster. It also seems very odd that Johnson’s PPS would issue the party invitation without his boss’s knowledge if not his instruction.

Jane Carter ● 1250d

I didn't vote for Boris (or the Conservative Party) 2 years ago. But I usually vote for the prospective MP who I feel has  Putney's interests at heart (I know, I know - I should vote for a Party and its Manifesto but having been disappointed in so many broken Manifesto promises I choose to vote differently).Am more than happy with Fleur as MP for Putney.But then again, I've never been taken in by Boris Johnson and I feel sad (and angry) that 13 million voters (was it really that many?) were taken in by him (and some still are, it seems).

Lucille Grant ● 1250d

David,No, it is not a surprise but the extent of their deviousness certainly is.He won the election based on the same lies as the referendum.  It was all about leaving the EU, with no oven ready deal and it was all a fabrication to get into power.He is in power and his performance is really disgusting.  Pandemic?  The NHS saved his skin, the very NHS which he proposed to privatise through a bill that will be introduced in Parliament either this week or next week.Two short years?  Normally I would say yes but under the current circumstances, it is an eternity.

Ivonne Holliday ● 1250d

"It is about integrity and honesty and BoJo and his cahoots have none of this."Sorry, this is supposed to be a surprise? Johnson won a massive electoral majority just over 2 years ago. His lack of integrity and honesty was known then. It was acceptable to 13 million voters. So what has changed? Were we stupid or were we fooled? Who fooled us? Upon whom do we depend for our news and our knowledge, and what did they tell us?Two short years.

David Ainsworth ● 1250d

Agreed, Ivonne. It's not just having a party, it's the fact there seem to have been a number of dubious gatherings and the deceit in attempts to cover them up. Funny how it's always that stray email that catches up with people...

Michael Ixer ● 1250d

Wait until the next Election. Tories will lose a lot of seats and not a moment too soon.

Lucille Grant ● 1250d

I think the whole issue is beyond conservatives and labour.It is about integrity and honesty and BoJo and his cahoots have none of this.

Ivonne Holliday ● 1250d

Sue, people in Boris's entourage follow his lead. I seem to recall how thrilled you were when he became PM. Are you still proud of him after all the lies and betrayals of the British public during his tenure?

Lucille Grant ● 1250d

Well, we now know why this government makes such bad decisions. They're all p*ssed at their meetings because their meetings are just like everyone else's parties. Lots of wine, no agenda, meeting notes or minute takers. 

Michael Ixer ● 1250d

"I think there are very many aggrieved Tory members...."And they will find an acceptable Johnson replacement. I cannot imagine them going in any numbers for Starmer's Labour.

David Ainsworth ● 1250d

Meanwhile, and hopefully significantly, "The government’s use of a so-called VIP lane to award contracts for the supply of personal protective equipment to two companies during the first wave of the Covid-19 pandemic was unlawful, the high court has ruled." [Today].More home-roosting chickens?

David Ainsworth ● 1250d

what I find extraordinary is that Boris clearly thinks (oxymoron?) that not answering the question is A) a good decision or B) the issue will simply go away.

Adam Tripp ● 1250d

I think there are very many aggrieved Tory members....

Ivonne Holliday ● 1250d

"As a Tory member and one time activist I have to admit that not only is it time  for Bojo to go but for the good of the vitality of our democracy for another party to run the country"Is there one?

David Ainsworth ● 1250d

I totally agree with you Hugh. Just had a look at the front pages on the BBC website and, although the Daily Star is certainly not a newspaper I follow, I must say its front page today in the Yes Prime Minister style is an absolute cracker!

Ivonne Holliday ● 1250d

Or someone who has a strong sense of what is right and what is wrong?  Why wait so long to leak the email?  At the time, things were very difficult for most of us and so many people dying.  Also, perhaps hoping things would improve which, sadly, they haven't.  We have all seen the photograph of a so-called working meeting (with no note taking, no laptops) in the garden of No. 10 in the summer. Is this photograph of the party on 20 May or another one?

Ivonne Holliday ● 1250d

As a Tory member and one time activist I have to admit that not only is it time  for Bojo to go but for the good of the vitality of our democracy for another party to run the country

Hugh Thompson ● 1250d

That should have read "I don't think sleepers are uncommon ..."

Michael Ixer ● 1250d

It could be that, as it was May 2020 and so very early in the pandemic, anyone who felt that the leadership of the party was behaving wrongly would keep quiet at that time as the most important thing was to fight the pandemic. Letting the public know that the leaders did not obey the rules could well have caused real damage to the necessary solidarity and rule-obedience at that early and dangerous stage. This could have resulted in a higher death rate. Twenty months on things are different.

David Ainsworth ● 1250d

Someone who discovered they'd been dropped off the 2020 Christmas Party invite list when that one came to light? I'd guess someone who at the time of the party was happy to keep their head down but has recently been disadvantaged, disaffected or seen an opportunity? Or accepted some money or favour from a journalist? I don't think sleepers aren't uncommon with respect data leaks. There's a lot of money in the data loss prevention software market to stop it. A lot of data loss is inadvert but there's a lot of malicious stuff as well, and I suspect Johnson may gave accumulate a few enemies? Regardless of all the software controls it's difficult to stop someone photographing a screen and printing a copy of the image at home that they they pass onto someone in a pub?

Michael Ixer ● 1250d

Can you say why it seems extraordinary? Does the delay invalidate it in some way?

David Ainsworth ● 1250d

I have to agree Paul,I'm not doubting the email but it does seem extraordinary that it has been sat on until now.

Ed Robinson ● 1250d

It's true none of us has seen the email but I'm sure Sue Gray will have access to the MS Exchange email journal file. It would seem strange for ITN News to risk their journalistic reputation if they weren't fairly convinced of the email's veracity (although I agree they wouldn't have access to the journal records) - but if he wasn't there and wasn't aware of the party why doesn't he just say so?His future I'd in the hands of Tory MPs (and MSPs?).

Michael Ixer ● 1251d

It's interesting that we hear that about 100 people were invited and only 30 turned up.

Philippa Bond ● 1251d

I think it's highly likely Boris was there and I understand why people are angry and upset.  However all the others who attended this 'party' are also culpable because they knew the rules and were happy to break them. I don't think Boris' resignation serves much purpose to be honest. Tomorrow in PMQs he must admit he was there, admit he has made grave errors and apologise profusely. If he manages to hold onto his premiership he has to take a strong grip on this situation and stress to his colleagues, and more importantly to the public, that there will be no more of these gatherings.  And tell his wife to stop interfering.

Sue Hammond ● 1251d

No date on the email. Nobody said anything at the time. Very strange.

Paul Rolink ● 1251d

"Let's see if he was there before we erect the scaffold though."How quaint and old-fashioned. Not a done thing in the UK over the last few years especially. Still, why not? A sort of heritage thing, I guess. Mind you, it won't catch on.-----------------------------------Deny, deny, deny.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGu8qiBUf-4

David Ainsworth ● 1251d

The Scottish Tories don't seem happy - Douglas Ross, the current leader, says Johnson must resign if he went to the party and he should state now if he did or didn't attend the event. Its not going to affect the outcome of the current investigation. One assumes, as with his failure to attend Parliament today to answer Rayner's question, he's just hoping the issue will go away and leaving others to cover over his mess. (Unless he got so drunk at the event he can't remember if he was there ...)https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/downing-street-covid-party-douglas-ross-demands-boris-johnson-resign-if-he-lied-over-lockdown-party-as-tory-fury-grows-3523594

Michael Ixer ● 1251d

If he was at that event on 20th May he should go .... agreed.Let's see if he was there before we erect the scaffold though.

Andy Pike ● 1251d

On Mother’s Day 22 March 2020, I had to leave the presents I bought for my mum at the Reception of her carehome and I was not allowed to see her.  11 days later she passed away. Although I was allowed in during her last days, I was not there for her at the end.  I have already commented on her funeral in May when I was not allowed to place a French flag on the coffin because of cross contamination. I wept when I saw the MP crying on t.v this afternoon, when he was talking about his mother-in-law.  Everything is being brought up again, and causing families of those who died in care homes much pain. Time for the Prime Minister to go now.

Martine Guy ● 1251d

@Richard, Ellis looked like he was set up and out of his depth. The speaker seemed to take pity on him at one time - what did he say? Sssh, give him a chance; he's got a difficult enough job without that (or similar). I noticed none of the cabinet seemed to be there to back him up ...

Michael Ixer ● 1251d

RIP  Magawa. It's unfair to call Johnson a rat: it's an insult to rats :-(

Michael Ixer ● 1251d

Oh no, Magawa is a real hero and doesn't deserve to be on this thread!  A real example to the younger generation too.

Philippa Bond ● 1251d

Meanwhile a really useful rat:-https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-57345703"Magawa the hero rat retires from job detecting landmines"

David Ainsworth ● 1251d

Yes, I never especially liked Davidson but she really does deserve respect for her honesty in this. Compare her statement with that by Michael Ellis, apparently (who knew?) the Paymaster General, in his answer in the Commons today: Ellis apologised to MPs “for the upset that these allegations have caused” - a classic non-apology apology.

Richard Carter ● 1251d

@Sue. It is difficult but he's made a career out of escaping from his webs of deceit. To be honest I'm more worried about his incompetence - which is probably why we have one of the highest (the highest?) death rate from Covid in western Europe, and I'd better not raise the issues from his 'oven ready' Brexit deal (the NI mess, musicians stopped from European touring, fishing trawlers anchored in harbour for a year ...). It's interesting that Johnson's close associates - Cummings, Frost - have deserted him; as Andy says elsewhere, Michael Gove must be getting excited - I may not agree with or like Mr Gove's politics but I can respect what he's attempting to do for leaseholders, his decisiveness and better inte!lect.Interesting thought, following a comment in the Commons from Angela Rayner - did the neighbours at #11 complain about the noise in the garden next door, or did they get an invite?

Michael Ixer ● 1251d

Unfortunately I think you are right Adam.  Not sure about Gove becoming PM though.  He is an habitual back stabber and not popular either with his peer group or the party members. He also doesn't have any charisma so he would not be able to to engage with potential voters in my opinion.  However he excels at being devious.

Sue Hammond ● 1251d

No, not all the time. Just most of the time.

Alexander MacLeod ● 1251d

But he does that all the time ...

Michael Ixer ● 1251d

Oh no, please!!!  Not Michael Gove.  It would be like out of the frying pan into the fire!!

Ivonne Holliday ● 1251d

If Michael Gove pulls off a solution to the cladding issue he's on a winner. Cross party support - except from the opposition in the Lords from freehold owners and developers but everyone hates them and their support for feudal leasehold laws ... 

Michael Ixer ● 1251d

Has anyone spotted what I noticed on last night's TV news? When BJ is about to tell a porky, he hoods his eyes, for a micro-second glances to his left, and then purses his lips. BBC ran it twice, and so did Channel 4. Unmistakable.

Alexander MacLeod ● 1251d

Great respect for Ruth Davidson. A politician giving their honest feelings in an interview. Unlike Michael Fabricant putting up - as described by a lawyer - a valiant attempt to defend the indefensible.

Michael Ixer ● 1251d

I predict Michael Gove will be PM by the end of this year, Boris is a liability

Adam Tripp ● 1251d

Good one on Twitter from Michael Rosen:-"May 20 2020 Number 10 party. Damn, I missed it. I was in a coma. Just my luck."

David Ainsworth ● 1251d

I can't see a way for Boris to wriggle his way out of this one.  Who is leaking all this information?  Dominic Cummings?

Sue Hammond ● 1251d

A fine response to Bozo's shifty havering: "This line won’t survive 48 hours. Nobody needs an official to tell them if they were at a boozy shindig in their own garden. People are (rightly) furious. They sacrificed so much – visiting sick or grieving relatives, funerals. What tf were any of these people thinking?” - and that was from Ruth Davidson, a Conservative, for goodness' sake!

Richard Carter ● 1251d