Forum Topic

Voting

Just heard on the News take a pencil out of their box and throw in another box afterwards. I thought we are meant to take our own Biro or Pen, when do you ever use a Pencil very easy to be rubbed out.

Barbara Stevens ● 1791d63 Comments

So maybe we will all have to have photo ID to vote.  This will disenfranchise many of the elderly who haven't travelled abroad or driven for years.  How will this work for those who choose postal votes?

Philippa Bond ● 1784d

Haven't a clue what your on about Matt.

Barbara Stevens ● 1787d

but you were dead against that Barbara, you can't have it both ways.

Matt Palmer ● 1787d

I think there are regular chargers - that charge slowlyandthere are superchargers - that charge quickly.The regular chargers are £500The superchargers somewhat more..

Mark Derry ● 1787d

I can't understand how some people never even received voting paper's who live in flats, or received their paperwork late. Perhaps they will do another vote like people wanted on Brexit, because they didn't like the result.

Barbara Stevens ● 1789d

Also if you have hardly no charging points in your road, how are you meant to have all the leads going from your house across the pavement if you haven't a drive. Lots of Insurance claims for people tripping over even if covered. Think of every house in a road both sides of the road with an Electric vehicle some with even two vehicles. Push chair's going over them, cycles, dogs biting them, weeing on them it's a joke.

Barbara Stevens ● 1789d

Thanks, Mr Sharp. Downloaded for reading later.

Michael Ixer ● 1789d

So worried that it looks like Sadiq Khan will win the election?

Matt Palmer ● 1789d

People are worried about their vehicles that they have to get rid of, but what also about their friends and relations who want to visit. Apart from parking in the road charges if you haven't a drive, they will also be paying if they have an older car to even visit you. Living in London is like living in the Berlin Wall and no Hammersmith Bridge. How can properties be sold or rented with all these restrictions, nobody will want to live here.

Barbara Stevens ● 1789d

Thank you Mr Ixer. Very nice historically based post. Allowed me to learn a new word too (intransigent)! Here is the paper I had in the back of my mind re:thought malleability Aging and Susceptibility to Attitude Change Jon A. Krosnic.

Simon Sharp ● 1789d

Simon. You were obviously trying to be controversial ... nothing wrong in using that as a way to promote discussion! I don't think there's always reduced malleability in opinions as one grows older - I guess one gets comfortable with the status quo but one may also base opinions on experience and require evidence to change that opinion. For example, some of my peers on this site would consider my pro EU views intransigent; however, it's based on the fact that EU (actually it was the EEC then) membership coincided with the start of my working life and overall I've only seen benefits from it; I've not seen any evidence of significant benefits yet from Brexit that would make me change that opinion, but I have seen many immediate disadvantages. However, one of many interests is astronomy and astrophysics, and one certainly can't have fixed opinions in that area. In the areas of car ownership and use my opinions have certainly shifted over the past ten (fifteen?) years, as has my view that the evidence for climate change means that global warming is a pending disaster of civilisation: the evidence is now overwhelming. I'd say most of my friends have similar views on the EU, climate change, etc but I suppose such groups are self selecting to a large extent - but I do have some friend I disagree with on Brexit  ... although some of those seem to have some doubts now.

Michael Ixer ● 1789d

@Simon Sharp"I am of course being inflammatory through frustration at views expressed here."Which views are you referring to exactly?

Sue Hammond ● 1790d

Thank you for your nice and balanced insight. Of course once again I am being prickly for rhetorical purposes and certainly a large proportion of the freedom passers are reasonable individuals. Interesting about potential lack of awareness earlier on in older generations lives and I guess that's something that is perhaps overlooked. How to change concrete thoughts - that's the hard part. I think the evidence potentially points to a reduced malleability in opinion the older you get - from memory

Simon Sharp ● 1790d

Simon. I sympathise that it is easy to get frustrated with some of the posts on this site. I note the site you've referenced is a US one, although it probably reflects tendencies in the UK as well. However, I think one should be careful when using generalisations. Many, let's say, of the "Freedom Pass" generations realise the dangers of the greenhouse effect, pollution, and the resulting climate changes and environment damage, etc being caused; plus they did not support Brexit and the opportunities that denies to many youngsters. It might be fair to argue that it took a while to realise the damage being done to the planet but that was in part caused by obfuscation of information by those in power and with vestred interests in profiting from the processes causing the damage.The real challenge is how, in a democracy, to get those denying the crisis to accept the urgency to change their way of life? 

Michael Ixer ● 1790d

@Mr Ixer. Thank you for raising the point. I am of course being inflammatory through frustration at views expressed here. In answer to your points studies do support a greater liberal to conservative (compared to vice versa). Furthermore attitude to environment by age is described here: https://news.climate.columbia.edu/2019/02/04/age-gap-environmental-politics/

Simon Sharp ● 1790d

Simon. I think you should elaborate further on that. Can you correlate age with voting intent with regard to green credentials, electric cars, Brexit, etc? 

Michael Ixer ● 1790d

This thread shows that people above a certain age need to be directed to the pens that contain invisible ink for their ballot papers.

Simon Sharp ● 1790d

I think a charger attached to your house is about £500, not £5000!My dad got one thrown in when he bought his electric car a few weeks ago.

Matt Palmer ● 1790d

Thanks for that info Barbara.

Sue Hammond ● 1790d

Sue, one of our neighbours said the lamp posts are free at the moment. Also there are only 3 charging points in our road, if you have one attached to your house it will cost £5000.

Barbara Stevens ● 1790d

@Mark Derry"To keep this in perspective the cheapest second hand id3 is just under £30K for something a little bigger than a fiesta with a really small boot."Out of many people's range. You seem to know a lot about electric cars Mark so perhaps you can answer something that puzzled me yesterday.  There was a brand new (21 reg) BMW hooked up to the lamppost outside my house, it was there for about 5 hours which I assume must have been a full charge, so how does that get paid for?  To be honest I didn't even know lampposts were part of the charging network.

Sue Hammond ● 1790d

Probably measured in gallons per mile - LOL

Mark Derry ● 1790d

god only know's what the fuel cost would be also!

Matt Palmer ● 1790d

Time to buy a 40 year old 6.8L Rolls Royce and not pay a penny in ULEZ.But probably pay as much fixing it :(But at least you'll have a tad more style than a Nissan Leaf...

Mark Derry ● 1790d

To keep this in perspective the cheapest second hand id3 is just under £30K for something a little bigger than a fiesta with a really small boot.

Mark Derry ● 1790d

Also, if a VW id.3 was your new car of choice it's carbon neutral through the entire supply chainhttps://www.volkswagenag.com/en/news/stories/2019/11/how-volkswagen-makes-the-id-3-carbon-neutral.html

Matt Palmer ● 1790d

And the rollout of 350kW chargers means range and charge time will be resolved in the future ...https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/101586/uk-s-first-350kw-ev-charging-station-opens-in-kenthttps://www.ecotricity.co.uk/our-news/2021/ecotricity-and-gridserve-to-power-the-electric-highway

Michael Ixer ● 1790d

Matt. Our postal votes didn't arrive at all. I had to go to Wandsworth Town Hall Tuesday to collect replacements after phoning on Friday. Must admit Wandsworth were very helpful and efficient at dealing with this.

Michael Ixer ● 1790d

I think point 2) is less correct than a few years ago.  Renewables are steadily growing as a % of our total energy generation - over 50% on occasion and averaging 30-40% most of the time.See https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/data-portal/electricity-generation-mix-quarter-and-fuel-source-gb

Jonathan Callaway ● 1790d

They absolutely will count. Depending on where the cameras are you could pay merely for driving the length  of the Lower Richmond Rd. But once you’ve qualified for the charge you’re free to drive your ‘polluting’ car for the whole day. If your car qualifies as a classic, and by definition extremely bad in terms of exhaust fumes never mind not even having a catalytic converter, bingo! You can go free into both UKEZ zones.

Freddie Francis ● 1790d

Mark. Reasonable comments, although pollution and green gases created in a manufacturing plant are easier to contain and manage. Cost is an issue but one expects prices to drop as manufacturing scales up and maintenance (excluding replacement batteries) is usually estimated to be cheaper. Also range and recharging time can be an issue -which could be problematic for some car club and care hire schemes that rely on those driving to "fill up" the vehicle.

Michael Ixer ● 1790d

When the ULEZ charge was first announced, I checked our car registration number and it said we would not have to pay.  I checked again today and we do have to pay now. We used our car to go to Chelsea &Westminster Hospital and I am hoping hospital visits don’t count for the ULEZ charge.

Martine Guy ● 1790d

£25 for the privilege of leaving  the area and returning the next morning. Or to take it for a service or repair if it needs more than a day’s work.

Freddie Francis ● 1790d

Also to keep ULEZ in perspective, you do only pay on the days that you use the car (if you reside within N/S Circular). So for people like me it's not the end of the world as I only tend to use my car occasionally.

Mark Derry ● 1790d

Many non-car owners aren't familiar with the some of the issues here. Three significant ones are:- 1) Teslas use a significant amount of rare minerals to produce and the production of one is not environmentally sound.2) The use of electric vehicles isn't zero pollution it just moves the pollution generation to somewhere else (NIMBY)3) Teslas are very expensive cars to buy so not a viable option for most and if the less expensive option is something like a Nissan Leaf then there are plenty of reports of people that have been caught out buying one ( £20K second hand) then having to spend £14K on a new battery.As I said before - pollution is bad no doubt but there really needs to be more thought put in to finding a viable solution.

Mark Derry ● 1790d

We got our postal votes in plenty of time but as Michael said you could just drop it at the polling station on the day if the deadline for posting had passed.

Matt Palmer ● 1790d

No one had to interfere when people such as myself received'out of time' postal votes

Barbara Shillabeer ● 1790d

I know that  Barbara but your imagination of armies of Khan fans changing ballot papers is ridiculous.i dislike the man intensely but have no doubt he will win without having to resort to anything like that. If you look at the counts on tv from elsewhere hiw do you think anyone could interfere with papers with all those people about? You are I'm afraid talking nonsense.

Andy Pike ● 1790d

Andy, it's on the front page of the Forum we might not here till Sunday. Sorry you haven't a sense of humour. But time will tell when we get the results.

Barbara Stevens ● 1790d

Andy, it's on the front page of the Forum we might not here till Sunday. Sorry you haven't a sense of humour. But time will tell when we get the results.

Barbara Stevens ● 1790d

Lots of petrol and diesel cars on the road now will still be compliant when the ULEZ is extended on 25 October.You can find the checker on the page below where you can check whether your vehicle will or won't be. https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/ultra-low-emission-zone/ulez-expansion

Philippa Bond ● 1790d

Do you really believe these ballot boxes will be left unattended in the town hall car park for anyone with a rubber to get to work.Why would they bother when they could simply steal the lot and declare the process null and void.Barbara I feel I've fallen for your little wind up as surely you do not live life seeing conspirators and cheats behind every door.

Andy Pike ● 1790d

We will not hear probably who will be Mayor till Sunday. Who will Police this? All the paper's very tempting for some to get who they want in.  You make a joke about Pencil's.

Barbara Stevens ● 1791d

Thanks for a sensible post.

Lucille Grant ● 1791d

There’s a lot of false information being touted by Shaun Bailey etc about the the ULEZ charges - virtually all petrol cars sold from 2005, plus some registered between 2001 and 2005, petrol vans sold after 2006 and motorbikes registered after July 2007 are ULEZ-compliant. Electric vehicles are automatically compliant as they produce zero tailpipe emissions.The way they’re telling it you would think that everyone has to pay.

Mary Walker ● 1791d

But they don't. People always say the pols are wrong and often they are.

Freddie Francis ● 1791d

Barbara, more like they don't want you to vote. Funny how they all seem to know who will win, before everybody has voted.

Barbara Stevens ● 1791d

Wed = we !!!

Michael Ixer ● 1791d

Wed delivered our postal votes to the polling station today. If you can't get there yourself can a friend or neighbour take it for you?

Michael Ixer ● 1791d

Me, I'd quite like to vote..  Do it by post.  The form arrived ok but the date for return was past! I know personally of one other person to whom this has happened. Is this a conspiracy against pensioners?

Barbara Shillabeer ● 1791d

No problem with pencils providing they have lead in 'em :)

Simon Knight ● 1791d

As long as I remember it's always been a pencil. Dont see an issue with it personally in this situation.

Andy Pike ● 1791d

The Americans spent tons of $s devising a pen that would work in zero gravity. The Russians used a pencil.

Simon Knight ● 1791d

Andy when do people ever use a pencil, why didn't they have the small biro's like in the Betting Office. Any form says use a black pen.

Barbara Stevens ● 1791d

Ha, Ha. Well I made the young man on the door laugh as well when I asked to use my biro not their pencil. In case they try and rub out the pencil votes.

Barbara Stevens ● 1791d

"You do have a mist active imagination and have clearly never witnessed an election count."Maybe not but Barbara's version of the event would be much more fun ...

Sue Hammond ● 1791d

Lol@Barbara!😸

Sue Hammond ● 1791d

Apparently 46% of London households don't own a car and of the 54% that do I would image many of those have ULEZ compliant ones - I've noticed a lot of Teslas around Putney. I guess there's many other issues that people make their decisions on? I'm not keen on a premature reward from pollution myself 🙂

Michael Ixer ● 1791d

You do have a mist active imagination and have clearly never witnessed an election count.One of the funniest posts I've ever seen on here.

Andy Pike ● 1791d

I'm surprised Sadiq Khan seems to be ahead in the polls. I'm not keen on having to pay £12.50 on the days I want to drive anywhere so I know who I'll be voting for...

Mark Derry ● 1791d

Well what if all the invigilators wanted Sadiq Khan still in. There will be a lot of rubbing going on under the table, suppose they could say they had itchy nuts.

Barbara Stevens ● 1791d

Well my other half took his own pen and asked to use it not a pencil. I'm going down there later. There wasn't a queue there were only 2 in front of him, only two allowed in at a time.

Barbara Stevens ● 1791d

Always used a pencil in voting booths. Why and who would want to rub it out. All ballots go in a sealed container opened in a room full of invigilators and counters when do you think anyone gets the time and privacy to rub out a vote? And how many would they need to do to  affect a result.

Andy Pike ● 1791d