Forum Topic

Brexit's going well ...

for the British expats in Spain. I fail to understand why anyone who lives - and plans to remain - in an EU country would have voted for Brexit. I feel some sympathy for those who didn't vote for Brexit  but something else I saw said many had problems as they'd never bothered to learn Spanish so weren't aware of what was going on. https://londonlovesbusiness.com/spain-to-kick-out-thousands-of-british-expats-under-post-brexit-rules/Obviously the government didn't care about the expats either otherwise they might have put some protecction in the deal. Still, there should be plenty of fruit picking jobs this summer ...

Michael Ixer ● 1856d16 Comments

One wonders if Brexit provides an opportunity for food producers who swap to vegan products - no hassles with vetinary certificates, although I'm not sure about the other bureaucratic steps involved in exports to the EU. It seems likely to be a growth area as "green" concerns rise on the public's agenda, particularly with younger consumers. I'm surprised Brexiteers aren't discussing such potential benefits for health, climate, animal welfare ... and businesses of the future?

Michael Ixer ● 1856d

I think the patent for the AZ. vaccine is held by Vaccitech Ltd which has shareholders including Oxford Science Innovations, Oxford University and Sarah Gilbert. I think it would not be viable to make the patent public domain as it would include other areas of research one might want to retain control of or it might compromise other licences issued sharing common areas of research - my non expert guess, I'm prepared to be corrected! So instead they issued non exclusive licences for manufacturing and supplying the vaccine at cost - AZ being the European company that signed up to do it, there are others around the world. Even if one doesn't want to make a profit, retaining the patent and issuing licences means one can retain control and stop a patent's use for purposes one doesn't approve of. (A bit like the Stones and others suing Trump for unauthorized use of their copyright music at his conventions 🙂) 

Michael Ixer ● 1856d

Hello Jonathan,Did expats vote in the 2016 referendum?  I was under the impression they were not allowed to vote.

Ivonne Holliday ● 1856d

Ed, traditionally it was said that travel broadens the mind but I have met expats in numerous countries who prove the opposite: that travel narrows the mind!  That may be a case here.Their vote for Brexit has certainly backfired here but it's too late now.  They can repent at leisure and maybe think what the loss of freedom of movement across 28 countries has cost all of us.

Jonathan Callaway ● 1856d

Astra Zeneca are selling at cost, much to the annoyance of the other vaccine producers.  Wasn't completely altruistic, at some stage they will allow themselves to raise their prices and make the same huge margins as Pfizer, etc.  And it may have been Oxford Uni that demanded a no-profit deal as the price for participation (Merck were in negotiations too, and the UK govt blocked that so that the vaccine could be produced in the UK not the US ... because the US was refusing to export any vaccines.

Jonathan Callaway ● 1856d

Hello Michael,Yes, it is very sad to see how many farmers and fishermen - among others - now regret Brexit.  There was a rather big and established fish and seafood exporting firm in Bridlington having to close down because of the losses they made when trying to export seafood to the EU but all was lost during the wait in the lorry park in Kent.It is sad to see how the fishing industry is going to pot, sadly.  There are plenty of happy British fish and seafood in British waters, all supposedly waving the Union Jack.... Perhaps they are so happy because they are no longer fished by British fishermen.  Perhaps there will be some continental ones coming along - very legally one might add!

Ivonne Holliday ● 1856d

Very selective memory Paul.  Brexit and COVID are two entirely different matters and should not be confused.  Politicizing a pandemic is, at the very least, of very bad taste and dubious humanity.The UK has done extremely well with the vaccine because of a massive public investment and the remarkable work of scientists at publicly-funded universities. We've rolled it out so successfully because of our incredible National Health Service.  And I stress, our amazing and irreplaceable NHS.Greed, however, drove big pharma to privatise this work and withhold doses from millions worldwide to protect their profits. Billions of public money have been spent on the development of the vaccines but the government refuses to waive patents on the treatments. Greed alright.  Hence, Oxford is manufacturing the vaccine in the EU (Netherlands and Belgium I believe) but, as stated before, they do not have the patent for the treatment. The EU paid some £356m for the Oxford vaccine last year. So, EU funds were also used for the development and you should bear this in mind.

Ivonne Holliday ● 1856d

I'm just interested how some of those groups who reportedly supported Brexit - farmers, fishermen, experts  the DUP - they got what they wanted but now don't seem to like it? Implies to me they didn't know what they were voting for. Seems to me Brexit is turning out as anticipated. Still waiting for someone to point out the advantages ... (Don't bother saying vaccines as that was all prepared during transition, under EU rules.)

Michael Ixer ● 1856d

Seems that some of those rejected have been working cash in hand or the like and not contributing to Spains economy. If that's correct who can blame Spain for taking the opportunity to get rid.

Andy Pike ● 1856d

Barbara - I think it was more a case of being stubborn or the opposite.They could have become resident before the visa requirement kicked in.Perhaps Spain's foreign asset/Spanish Wealth Tax tax may be the reason.

Ed Robinson ● 1856d

Perhaps they retired out there and have enough to live on. Otherwise you have to earn a certain amount to be allowed to stay. If they are retired, probably not taking any notice of paperwork.

Barbara Stevens ● 1856d

I agree with Matt and Andy,It was not logical but a lot did vote for Brexit. From what I heard there was lots of debates about it.Perhaps living abroad brings out more nationalistic feelings in some people. A case of heart over head may be a generous explanation.

Ed Robinson ● 1856d

Brexit's going very well. The EU have stuffed up big time over the vaccines, their populations can see it, they have threatened to retaliate against us & then backed down when they realised it was a no hoper. Humiliation or what. Why are you bothered about people who have emigrated? That's their problem. Anyone would think you have never got the referendum.

Paul Rolink ● 1856d

Matt and Andy. It does seem puzzling but no more than voting for Brexit if one's taking advantage of thge EU's freedom of movement. Some of those having to lkeave had residency permits rejected; the article doesn't say why. Perhaps their income was insufficient? 

Michael Ixer ● 1856d

I agree, I find it very hard to believe that some people didn't know at all, surely nobody is that clueless??

Matt Palmer ● 1856d

I dont know about tjisebin Soain but I'm sure this was public knowledge a year or so ago in the same way that EU nationals in this country had to apply to stay.So not that unexpected. I know the report talks about those without internet etc being unaware but they all surely new about brexit and would therefore ensure they were up to date with what they needed to do.

Andy Pike ● 1856d