Forum Topic

On the Buses

When I am travelling by bus I am getting a bit fed up because when I get on the bus, the windows are all closed.  I thought general Coronavirus advice was to keep windows open in shared spaces.  I opened a couple of windows today and another passenger closed one. I try to keep my distance and the man next to me positioned a bag on the seats so that he was closer to me than the bag.  This meant his bag was socially distanced but he wasn’t. Last week a woman took off her mask to eat her lunch and then use her mobile. Has TFL issued rules for bus travel, just wondering?

Martine Guy ● 1933d38 Comments

https://tfl.gov.uk/help-and-contact/contact-us-about-buses

Philippa Bond ● 1839d

Sorry for typo, should have read that because the 378 are frequent, they aren’t crowded.

Martine Guy ● 1839d

I think we need more buses on the 337 route.  It was standing room only at about 5.00 pm today, when I was travelling back from East Sheen.  When we reached Putney Leisure Centre, a lot of people were waiting to get on but the driver didn’t open the door for them, and opened the middle door to let someone off. People were doing their best to socially distance, but there wasn’t room to do so.  I have noticed there are long waits between buses and imo there aren’t enough buses on this busy route. Contrast this with the single decker, 378, service between Putney and Mortlake. I have used this several times this week and because they are frequent, they are uncrowned.

Martine Guy ● 1839d

didn't The Great Maggie say something about being on a bus?

Gregory Edelston ● 1893d

To be fair it's not quite a year.The concept of ventilation is very complicated for our governing bodies to understand. Possibly because all the heads  get driven around in air con cars!Take the cars away and I'm sure they will pick up what needs to be done immediately.

Ed Robinson ● 1912d

We do keep hearing that it is closed spaces that we should be doing our best to avoid.

Philippa Bond ● 1912d

I was on the bus yesterday and there are now signs up to Open the Window.  Nobody seemed to be doing this except me, but I was pleased to see the signs, maybe it will catch on eventually.

Martine Guy ● 1912d

Interesting report herehttps://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/01/health/coronavirus-bus-china.htmlI think I have read others where masks were worn too.

Ed Robinson ● 1923d

Interesting to see this:https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/sep/18/routemaster-buses-in-london-to-be-refitted-with-windows-that-openFive years ago.

Philippa Bond ● 1923d

Yeah  All Rights and No Responsibilities!I suppose the Govt would have to OK any spending on bus windows.Wearing a mask also helps to keep you warm - and everyone is supposed to be wearing masks on buses - or face coverings at least.https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own/face-coverings-when-to-wear-one-and-how-to-make-your-own

Philippa Bond ● 1925d

"given that at present anyone can close the windows, the obvious solution is to fix at least some of them on each bus so that it's impossible to close them."Impossible? You are underestimating the strength and ingenuity of a determined British vandal, conscious of his rights!

David Ainsworth ● 1925d

"obvious solution is to fix at least some of them on each bus so that it's impossible to close them"You would have thought so Richard but that does not appear to be the case.The best reason I have heard is that masks and distance are things we can do as individuals. Hence the government is keen to push those.Ventilation requires government and organisations to take action. That is a route the government do not want to go down because it implies they have some responsibility.If the R rate goes up they can blame individuals - nothing to do with them! (There is probably a legal term for this approach.)It's the only logical explanation I have heard in the last 10 months. If someone has a better explanation then please share.

Ed Robinson ● 1926d

Yes, it really is crazy, but given that at present anyone can close the windows, the obvious solution is to fix at least some of them on each bus so that it's impossible to close them.

Richard Carter ● 1926d

Libby Purves today’s Times, talking about what we can learn from the coronavirus crisis: “We could all do with a breath of fresh air” “Finally, there’s something cheaper to plan for post-pandemic: a small change of habit and expectation.  Let the air in!  Respiratory viruses love warm enclosed spaces and revel in air conditioning.  We are a notably frosty nation, huddling in sealed double-glazed boxes at home and at work, scorning buses and trains whose windows open ............”.

Martine Guy ● 1926d

Walked past SIX 22’s parked at Putney Common, every one had their Windows tightly Closed.I asked a Driver why this was, he replied “Passengers  get on and close them” This is not good enough, TFL should be instructing Drivers to open them at the end of every Run. Maybe stick Notices up as well!!  The Public just Don’t get it😩

Vic Condon ● 1929d

We hear more and more how important it is not to be in a closed room with others you don't live with or who are in your bubble...Did you see the people attending hospital appointments by cargo passenger bike being interviewed on TV.  Being shut in on public transport was exactly what they were avoiding.  As as they said they knew how to wrap up warm!  Some people nowadays don't seem to know how to dress for the weather.

Philippa Bond ● 1929d

I suggest that bus drivers are too scared to call out to offending passengers to behave appropriately.People are often still too casual about this dreadful situation.

Bob Bowmer ● 1929d

Unfortunately Govt guidelines are far too wishy washy because some of them are far more concerned in being popular.  TfL's money comes from Govt so unless Govt says "do it" it is unlikely to happen.  Why don't you lobby them?You can ask questions on the Mayor of London's website.

Philippa Bond ● 1930d

They should be fixed open.  Why is the Govt who are in charge of TfL not dealing with this???  The trouble with Boris is that he likes to be popular... I was horrified tonight to hear that medical staff in the General Covid Wards in hospitals are not being provided with the better masks.  No wonder so many become ill.

Philippa Bond ● 1930d

Ed, what I don’t understand is why aren’t windows being opened? It is common sense to let fresh air circulate.  The drivers are doing a fantastic job, but why aren’t they themselves opening the windows.  They are in a Union, who you would have thought would have been concerned about this.  Are drivers being told not to physically touch the windows because of COVID transmission?  The comment from Mailonline suggests the buses aren’t being cleaned properly.

Martine Guy ● 1933d

Sorry - I do not think TFL's actions are good enough!They collect the fares - they are responsible IMO.Windows should be fixed open at the beginning of service.It's not rocket science and we are 9 months into this with possibly another 9 months to go if we are lucky!

Ed Robinson ● 1933d

It's on the front page at the top about staff just come on there.

Barbara Stevens ● 1933d

Here’s a comment from the MailOnline comments under the article on TFL: “My son and his dad are London bus drivers.  I worry constantly everyday my son goes to work. He comes home and tells me of the passengers that get on without a mask and then the abuse he receives.  TFL aren’t looking after their drivers and the protection and cleaning are minimal”.

Martine Guy ● 1933d

"Masks should also be compulsory in public transport, imo."TFL:-"You must wear a face covering on public transport and in taxis and private hire vehicles."https://tfl.gov.uk/campaign/face-coverings#:~:text=On%20buses%20we%20have%20installed,when%20inside%20the%20driver%27s%20cab.

David Ainsworth ● 1933d

@ DM article re death re Covid statistics on staffMartine.  Do you not read enough posts on here to realize that the DM always lies?

Barbara Shillabeer ● 1933d

I agree, Andy, with what you say and because we seem to be dealing with the unknown with regards the virus, I think further measures need to be taken for public transport.  
I have rarely used the tube since the Pandemic started, but they are not so crowded that people can’t socially distance.  The buses are a different matter.  People don’t seem to want to change their behaviour. One girl asked if she could sit next to me on a double seat and I said no. Is it such a big deal to keep windows open?  I don’t think so.  Windows should have notices stuck on them saying they should not be closed because of the pandemic.  Masks should also be compulsory in public transport, imo. 

Martine Guy ● 1933d

Martine that's a sad statistic, but is it because they caught it on the buses or tube or at home. Until this us over and ALL professions are compared we wont really know the true impact across shop,bus train staff etc.CrCertainly those in the front line in our hospitals and medical centres are likely to have caught it at work but I think we need more info on others.

Andy Pike ● 1933d

That's really awful, Martine. Don't people know the dangers of not social distancing and not wearing a mask? If you can, I would avoid going on buses but I realise that for key workers that's not always possible. I think the mayor actually advised against buses for all but key workers.

Jane Carter ● 1933d

When the police were outside Clegg's place they didn't carry guns because, apparently, he didn't want that.  They were glad because the gun paraphernalia is heavy. A couple of years ago, after he lost his seat, I had to go to the US embassy when it was still in Grosvenor Square. When I walked out the gun-carrying Met guy beamed at me and I said "Hi. Did you ever do a stint outside Clegg's house? I live just round the corner". He replied, "I know".

Elizabeth Balsom ● 1933d

On MailOnline today “TFL reveals 57 staff killed by COVID, including 42 bus workers and 8 tube and rail staff”.

Martine Guy ● 1933d

TfL is in charge of the buses and has given plenty of advise regarding keeping windows open.As you said in the introduction Martine, you opened two windows and another passenger closed one of them.Leaving the depots with windows open I would agree, but it would not be long before they were closed by passengers. You can only keep opening them!

Ivonne Holliday ● 1933d

Ed, I think they had security each end of Nick Clegg's road. When I was walking onto the Upper Rich Rd early one morning, he was walking with his Security Guard and son taking him to Our Lady of Victory's School. Much to my annoyance I had to walk in the road so they could get past.

Barbara Stevens ● 1933d

I suspect the police accompanying the likes of Johnson and posted outside Clegg's house may be the gun carrying variety - or are in contact with some nearby ... I suppose they might put a few around Westminster Station as well?

Michael Ixer ● 1933d

"justified on the grounds of security"Yes I imagine how uncomfortable they might feel arriving late at night at a station with no staff present. It wouldn't be long before that was fixed though I bet?And it is strange that police presence is not meant to be effective but there was still one outside Clegg's house when he was deputy whatever!

Ed Robinson ● 1933d

I think the limos will be justified on the grounds of security ... although some ministers/MPs do use public transport. My wife and I were on a tube coming back from dinner in East London when David Davis got on it at Westminster late one evening. My wife and I wouldn't have recognised him only some sycophantic woman started telling him what a great job he was doing organising Brexit - although I think most Brexiteers thought he failed at that. We kept quiet but I think as we changed at Earl's Court as another couple began expressing displeasure with Brexit . Of course, Jeremy Corbyn was a great user of public transport when not cycling ...

Michael Ixer ● 1933d

I agree Martine and some of the most vulnerable travel by bus.The Mayor is in charge of TFL although the government now have seats on the board I understand. Layers of bureaucracy in between I guess. The bus drivers were hit very badly by this too and probably will again. TFL were slow to introduce safety measures being behind  Germany. That said the Mayor is a son of a former bus driver apparently! Yes if I was in charge I would remove limo's/chauffeur/taxis from all gov officials and force them to use public transport except myself of course :)

Ed Robinson ● 1933d

Thanks for the reply, Ed. People are travelling on buses without wearing a mask and it is not always easy to keep a safe distance once you are inside.  Keeping windows open ventilates the bus and I think TFL should make every bus leave the depot with its windows open. Is the Mayor in charge of TFL?  If so, I am surprised the Conservative Party haven’t criticised him about this.  Makes you wonder how many of our politicians use public transport.  If they were travelling on buses, they might share our concern.

Martine Guy ● 1933d

Martine - I gave up looking at buses and seeing how many had all or most their windows shut and that was before the cold weather.Sadly if you look at the link below, the expectation is that YOU will open the windows. This is ludicrous - are you expected to walk around the bus lean over people and open all the windows - perhaps bring a bag of tools because some are secured closed!It's almost a year now - the windows should have been fixed open. This unfortunately IMO is down to the Mayor/TFL lacking detail - small practical things like windows can help reduce the spread."Where possible, sit next to a window and open it for better ventilation. Make sure the bus windows stay open."https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/buses/using-buses-in-london

Ed Robinson ● 1933d