Forum Topic

Extinction rebellion in central London

There was a demonstration in Parliament Square yesterday and the police were active - and their reaction inadvertently sums up the whole thing. Commander Jane Connors is reported as saying that “The reason we have implemented these conditions [to counter the demonstration]  is that we know these protests may result in serious disruption to local businesses, commuters and our communities and residents, which I will not tolerate.”This, of course, misses the point by a wide margin: the protests are an attempt to bring attention to the looming crisis, in which "the disruption to local businesses, commuters and our communities and residents" will be many, many times worse than will have occurred yesterday. Urgent action is needed to counter global heating: that is the real issue and our incompetent government is sitting on its hands.

Richard Carter ● 2259d59 Comments

Richard, I pray that you're right and Extinction Rebellion has pure motives.I have been quite frightened by reading about the BLM movement, and their core beliefs and values.

Bunny Payne ● 2259d

Bunny, i'm a member of XR as you know, there's nothing sinister going on I can assure you. I am, as ever happy to answer any questions.

Matt Palmer ● 2259d

Why have the police had to arrest so many then.

Barbara Stevens ● 2259d

Because they were breaking the law Barbara.Just like the suffragettes did.

Matt Palmer ● 2259d

Well Matt. don't you think your wasting police time.

Barbara Stevens ● 2259d

I'm well aware that plenty of time is being wasted.The police are having their time wasted in having to police our events. We are having our time wasted because the goverment refuses to listen.The government is wasting time when the IPCC says there is no time to waste.

Matt Palmer ● 2259d

I passed the protestors this morning and the amount of police far exceeded the amount of protesters I saw, when you read that one of the people arrested was a 92 year old man (please note that he doesn’t need a car to get everywhere) you do wonder if it was a bit OTTAt the end of the day they are never violent protests, and central London is still dead so it wouldn’t really have mattered if they were blocking roadsIMO it’s the police presence that made it front page news

Emma Blackwell ● 2259d

If you ignore those seeking publicity hopefully they'll go away.😁😁 note they didnt do it whilst half price dinners were on offer. 🍺🌭🍕🥩🍟 Maybe when furloughs over they'll return to the day job.🚇🚂⛽

Andy Pike ● 2259d

Another colossal waste of @metpoliceuk's time and resources looking after lots of people who have the great luxury of clearly not needing to be at work, whilst they prevent others from getting to work. #winning #xr #extinctionrebellion https://t.co/akLVDLud2Z

Ash Jones ● 2259d

I always found the suffragettes confusing as only men who owned property could vote at the time I believe.So I assume the movement wasn't breaking the law to get representation for all women.Small slightly irrelevant point but interesting from a class perspective.

Ed Robinson ● 2259d

Don't you realise that you've completely missed the point? It's  hardly a "colossal waste of @metpoliceuk's time and resources" compared with the truly colossal waste of everyone's time and resources involved in the effects of global heating. That's the real issue here and is what the protestors are trying to raise awareness about. Even Wadsworth Council has noticed there's a climate emergency, even though they're not prepared to do much about it.

Richard Carter ● 2259d

Unless one is following the alternative Piers Corbyn theory that climate warming is all down to solar activity and the resulting CO2 is good for us ... (Actually, I think Lunar activity may be part of the this theory now, seems sort of appropriate?)

Michael Ixer ● 2259d

Andy, I'm sure we've been here before but i'll repeat myself again as it seems your memory is failing you.I and everyone else I know involved in this movement either had a job or is retired. I have to take time off work every time I take part in an action.Hope that helps

Matt Palmer ● 2259d

No memory issues Matt. Afraid I am not convinced that all these pan bashers are gainfully employed or retired.

Andy Pike ● 2258d

If suffragettes weren't 'breaking the law' Ed, why were they arrested and thrown into prison?

Lucille Grant ● 2258d

Lucille - I didn't say that they were not breaking the law!

Ed Robinson ● 2258d

Actually, Matt, I don't think Andy's heart is really in it. He could have gone the full eight pints Nick Gulliford and launched a daft rant about the great unwashed, but he passed up on the opportunity. Bit of a disappointment, really.

Richard Carter ● 2258d

Hello Ed,You said:  "So I assume the movement wasn't breaking the law to get representation for all women."As Lucille did, I also understood that the women weren't breaking the law.  The movement without women would not have been a movement.

Ivonne Holliday ● 2258d

https://theconversation.com/ipcc-the-dirty-tricks-climate-scientists-faced-in-three-decades-since-first-report-145126

Philippa Bond ● 2258d

Unlike some on here Richard I dont feel the need to be rude to disagree with others.

Andy Pike ● 2258d

BREAKING: Extinction Rebellion protest blocking NHS ambulance. https://t.co/FpEhHq99c0

Ash Jones ● 2258d

You need to get your facts straight i'm afraid.1) Part of Victoria street was blocked by Animal Rebellion, not Extinction Rebellion 2) If you care to dig out the photos from the event you can see that the police took the decision to block the road at both ends. XR (and presumably AR) policy is that emergency vehicles are always allowed through. If the police choose to close the road that's their decision.3) Not sure what is hypocritical...

Matt Palmer ● 2258d

Absolute freak show.Too much time on their hands. Need to go and get a proper job!https://twitter.com/SteveRightNLeft/status/1301147453257809920

Ash Jones ● 2258d

LOLOL, now even i'll admit that's a bit nuts!

Matt Palmer ● 2258d

Sorry for not being clear Lucille and Ivonne."..as only men who owned property could vote at the time I believe.So I assume the movement wasn't breaking the law to get representation for all women."It's the property ownership requirement that I'm referring to. So the movement was not for representation for ALL women.

Ed Robinson ● 2258d

Reminds me of Morris Dancers.I thought they were extinct!

Ed Robinson ● 2258d

Hello Ed,Thank you for your response.The suffragette movement was for votes for women, not home ownership.  The latter did not happen until the 1980s.From a programme on Radio 4, I learnt that I was one of the first women in the UK to get a mortgage on her own right without my father's permission.  I was not married then!  :-) :-) :-)

Ivonne Holliday ● 2258d

Who'd have thought that women in New Zealand got the vote in the 1890s and women in the UK in the 1920s

Philippa Bond ● 2258d

I think the point is that in 1918 only women over 30 who owned property were given the vote whereas at the same time voting was extended from property owning men to all men over 21. It wasn't until ten years later that all women over 21 were given the vote. Single women could own property at that time but couldn't borrow money without a male guarantor until the 1975 sex equality act.

Michael Ixer ● 2258d

Thanks Michael for putting it so clearly.

Ed Robinson ● 2258d

You're welcome. One thing I didn't make clear was that married women, after the Married Women's Property Act of 1882, could also own and control property in their own right.

Michael Ixer ● 2258d

The 1893 Electoral Act gave all New Zealand women the vote, including Māori - that's everyone over 21 I believe.So NZ was way ahead of the UK (1928 women over 21 got the vote).Might explain the current situation :-)

Ed Robinson ● 2258d

One wonders, Ed. Would Mrs Thatcher or Mrs May have been better? Difficult to image them being as clueless as the current PM? Mrs Merkel seems to be doing well so perhaps understanding scientific method (which Mrs Thatcher would have) is also important?

Michael Ixer ● 2258d

What year was that Ivonne? I bought my first home as a singleton in 1977.

Lucille Grant ● 2258d

It was 1984.  I did not need my father's permission then, forget about a husband as I was single then.I shared a lovely house in Fulham with a friend of mine in 1979.  She managed to get a mortgage only because her father said she was trustworthy.How times have changed, in this case, for the better!

Ivonne Holliday ● 2258d

I do not think Mrs T would have given either Borris or Mrs May a job.Name Boris' achievements during 2 terms of mayor or Mrs May at the home office for 10 years and you be hard pushed.Love or hate her Mrs T was on the ball - (ok not sure about the end) she transformed the UK (for good or bad) and she was well briefed including detail - it could be the scientific background. Old red Ken used to quote science, detail and evidence and he did transform London (for good or bad)...Sorry going off topic a bit - a bit worrying the mass arrests I have just seen on twitter. But I would not like to be the one that calls such things with such a fragile recovery.But i would say with my limited historical knowledge that the real change happened in 1944-5 with the eleven plus results.Look at he GCSE results broken down by gender across ethnicity and social group - as a society we haven't come to terms with this.

Ed Robinson ● 2258d

It was a long time before women were allowed to enter into hire purchase agreements on their own. Considering that so any of those were for domestic white goods I find that quite surprising.

Philippa Bond ● 2257d

Something to reflect on ...Oil: "It is the devil's excrement. We are drowning in the devil's excrement." As declared in 1975 by Juan Pablo Pérez Alfonzo (Venezuela's oil minister in the early 1960s).

Michael Ixer ● 2257d

I read on twitter XR also been protesting outside the BBC studios.One far left group protesting about another far left group lol

Ash Jones ● 2256d

"I read on twitter XR also been protesting outside the BBC studios.One far left group protesting about another far left group lol"Have I misunderstood your post, or are you seriously claiming that the BBC is a far left group?

Richard Carter ● 2256d

That'll be because of that Andrew Neil.  Terrible leftie.

Jonathan Callaway ● 2256d

Of course it depends where you are on the political spectrum a source says!

Ed Robinson ● 2256d

I remember during the last election campaign a politician from a Nordic country saying that while the papers labelled Corbyn a 'far left' person, out in Norway or wherever he'd be a mere lib dem.

Matt Palmer ● 2256d

In recent decades the general public wouldn't have known the political persuasion of the BBC news anchor staff and journalists as they showed impartiality and professionalism in their job role.  That has all changed in recent years. You can find out for yourself the political persuasion of the current crop by their personal twitter posts.So Richard, I suggest you stop acting the naive fool!

Ash Jones ● 2256d

Ash, you have missed the posts by ten miles!BBC lefty?  Ha ha ha ha!! As far as I am aware, the BBC has been blamed for being in cahoots with the government, meaning the right.Can we all find common ground as to what is meant today by a "lefty or a righty"?

Ivonne Holliday ● 2256d

Isn't the important word here 'personal'?

Matt Palmer ● 2256d

Matt, I am lost. Personal?

Ivonne Holliday ● 2256d

Ash seems to think that journalists shouldnt be allowed to express opinions on their personal twitter accounts.I didnt realise journalists were supposed to be robots.....

Matt Palmer ● 2256d

Ahhhh! Ok.  Let us see what Ash says in his reply!

Ivonne Holliday ● 2256d

That's going to get interesting. I notice, for example, that the Twitter account Laura Kuenssberg uses is @bbclaurak. I'm assuming that it is a BBC official accounts so any tweets ought to be in line with BBC policies. I don't know, but she may well have another personal Twitter account where one assumes she can express her own views (although most companies have a stipulation that employees shouldn't do anything that might damage its reputation) although it would seem reasonable to be able to express one's views on personal social media, like we do on this forum  - but would the general public distinguish between Tweets from the two accounts?

Michael Ixer ● 2256d

Michael, a source says it's ok for LK as long as she says exactly what the source says :-)

Ed Robinson ● 2256d

LOL

Michael Ixer ● 2256d

I thought a lefty or a righty was in what order they kept their bits in their underpants.

Barbara Stevens ● 2255d

Lib Dems are right of centre. (Liberalism isn't a left/right thing. Libertarian/Authoritarian is the North/South to the left/right's East/West on the political compass.)https://www.politicalcompass.org/uk2019

John Kettlekey ● 2255d

Yes but the point I was making was that while some people here put Labours policies in the far left category, they would belong in the centre left in other countries.

Matt Palmer ● 2255d

Where does that leave women politicians and commentators,  Barbara?

Michael Ixer ● 2255d

Corbyn's  view of Labour was far left Matt. Starmer's more centre left I suspect. France's left wing party, Parti de Gauche, led  by Jean-Luc Melenchon is of the Corbyn persuasion and is a spin off from the Socialist Party. They also still have a Communist Party so the left wing is covered, and split. If that should happen here with a Momentum-style party and the rump of Labour left behind we'll see the Conservatives for the rest of my lifetime.

Lucille Grant ● 2255d

"Starmer's more centre left I suspect."Apart from Brexit - I don't think there has been any change of policy.Even on Brexit Starmer has moved away from a second referendum.

Ed Robinson ● 2255d

In the middle of no where.

Barbara Stevens ● 2255d