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What emotive nonsense.Buses are allowed in LTNs. There's even sections in the updated guidance:https://www.livingstreets.org.uk/media/3844/lcc021-low-traffic-neighbourhoods-detail-v9.pdfAgain, some useful quotes for you:-"BUS GATESAllow access for buses (and/or delivery and resident vehicles), often via triggered rising bollards or Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) cameras. Rising bollards can incur maintenance costs, and while ANPR can generate revenues, the lack of a physical barrier means they can be ignored by some drivers. Bus gates work very well to ensure buses can pass through an area and don’t need rerouting, while an entire cell can still be filtered to other motor traffic."So, pretty conclusive that LTNs do not require buses to be rerouted.Signs, cameras and FPNs seems to be the way that Wandsworth likes to do it. If people can't abide by the signs then they have to pay the price for doing so. No-one is forced to drive through a "No Entry" sign, they do so out of laziness or just not caring.Children being able to play in roads is a lofty goal of an LTN but it doesn't automatically apply to every road within the LTN. If the LTN in successful and through traffic is all but cut out and therefore total traffic is reduced then there may be some (hopefully many) streets/roads where it would become possible for children to play in the road they otherwise would not be able to.To assume that children will suddenly be able to play in the middle of Dover House Road is missing the point completely.As for the comments elsewhere about alternative rat-run routes being left in, and that being some kind of flaw, is acknowledged in the link:-"REMOVE ALL THE THROUGH TRAFFICLeaving in any through routes, unless they are very circuitous, simply focuses traffic on fewer streets. This will reduce the benefits of the scheme and could lose it goodwill over time. It also ensures there is less or no “traffic evaporation”. When through traffic is completely removed, the experience in general is that main roads have far more capacity to cope than the residential side streets – so increases in motor vehicle volumes seen on main roads are low in percentage terms, and after an initial period of bedding in, traffic settles to broadly where it was before. 15% or so of traffic over the area is likely to “evaporate” in such schemes – moving out of the area entirely or switching mode. In other words, congestion doesn’t go up with these schemes, in general."So, it specifically mentions "circuitous" through routes, which is exactly what the council has done with both the Dover House LTN and the West Putney LTN (with the Genoa/Chartfield/Solna/Westleigh detour).

John Kettlekey ● 2037d

"So, residents of Dover House Road and surrounding roads will not be able to enter or exit DHR on either end ever?"No, that's not what it is at all. I don't know where you get "either end" from at all. Maybe you can explain what you think is happening and we'll see if that fits with reality. Give an example of a current journey that you don't think will be possible after the changes.There's no consequences for disabled or elderly residents apart from spending an extra minute or two navigating the necessary diversion.You can't turn into DHR from Parkstead Road or vice versa. That's it (for DHR at least).If you live at the end of Huntingfield Road (or Putney Park Lane) just North of the junction with Parkstead Road you'll need to go North and round to come down Pleasance Road, once you've used to that to get to Parkstead Road then you can continue South on any of the roads (including Dover House Road).If you want to go from URR to Putney Heath you can go:-Dover House Road, The Pleasance, Pleasance Road, Parkstead Road, Dover House Road, Putney Heath.or:-Dover House Road, The Pleasance, Pleasance Road, Sunnymead Road / Dover Park Drive, Putney Heath.You can still get through both ways, just not straight down Dover House Road as you could before.Yes there are signs at each end of DHR to say there's no access to the other end, but that's not entirely true is it? You can't still work around it, as the locals will know. But those who rat-run through the area will be put off by those signs and the "road closed" or "dead end" signs they come across if they try and ignore it.The whole point of this is to make the journey that too many people use as a rat-run less attractive.Locals will get to know how to get around it. Non-locals will find their Sat Nav doesn't help, and will either ignore the signs (and get caught, be fined, which helps keep your council tax down) and/or be strongly discouraged from trying to rat-run through the same area.No-one is being cut off. People are being mildly inconvenienced which is a small price to pay for hopefully a better situation for the residents.I'm sorry I even mentioned Erphingham Road, seems it was too much for people to see the parallels in what the council is attempting to achieve.

John Kettlekey ● 2038d

Hello John, You say:   "No, you're not missing something. They're not exactly alike [meaning Replingham Road and Dover House Road], merely an example of how an anti-rat-running measure can't be installed in a way that doesn't affect the local residents in exactly the same way." So, residents of Dover House Road and surrounding roads will not be able to enter or exit DHR on either end ever?  I very much doubt that can be the case.  What will the consequences be for the disabled and/or elderly residents?  No ANPR at all? I understand taxis are not allowed in either. It is madness. The reason Dover House Road and Erpingham Road cannot be compared is that for the latter, the closure is for morning rush hour only.  But the main reason you cannot compare DHR with Erpingham Road is because DHR does not get direct traffic from Roehampton Lane, Medfield Street does — and to a lesser extent Roehampton High Street.  If you do not deal with the root of the problem, you do not solve the problem.  Medfield Street gets the brunt of this (it is not a main/trunk road by the way) and, believe it or not, most of the traffic goes onto Putney Heath and not Dover House Road.  DHR does get traffic from URR directly but not to the same extent as Replingham Road.  The problem with the bottom of DHR is that cars are parked on both sides of the road so only cars or buses can go past one at a time.  The rest of DHR is virtually free, easy going and appears much wider and dare I say it, traffic free? But the real root of the problem is the end of the A3.  The traffic can go down Roehampton Lane, Putney Hill or West Hill.  I cannot understand why a Park and Ride system cannot introduced. One bus can take up to, say, 80 passengers.  In rush hour, if there are 10 buses, that is 800 cars off the road — a sobering thought! This whole scheme was devised by the Department of Transport and it delegated the responsibility of implementation to various authorities in the country with the promise of extra funding.  For London, it was TFL who involved Local Authorities, also with the stick-and-carrot of additional funding.  I think, but have no proof, that DHR was already on the books and, instead of considering morning and evening rush hour, they have closed it completely.  I feel sorry for the independent shops on the parade who had absolutely no idea this was going on....   You also say: "Eventually most cars (drivers?) will realise there's little point trying to rat-run through these residential areas and they'll keep to the main/trunk roads (where they should really be) that are going to be busy regardless."   So, a solution for DHR is that does not get traffic from a main/trunk road but a problem is transferred/exacerbated in the latter on congestion and pollution does not matter?  Therefore, would it be incorrect to draw the conclusion that, provided DHR has no traffic, anything else is everybody else's problem?


Ivonne Holliday ● 2039d

Sorry if it wasn't clear. Let me clarify:-"It is just signs (and cameras supposedly) being put up to prevent anything other than buses or cyclists going between Dover House Road and Parkstead Road (or vice versa).  This is a junction, so how can they go between this particular junction????"I meant going between the named roads (Dover House Road and Parkstead road), e.g. turning from Dover House Road into Parkstead Road, or vice versa. "Buses, emergency vehicles, pedestrians and drivers who want to ignore the signs (and risk a fine) will still be able to drive through that junction either way.      This is really incomprehensible —"Oh for the lack of an Oxford comma.Buses: no fineEmergency vehicles: no fineCyclists: no finePedestrians: no fineDrivers not covered by the above that choose to do it anyway: risk of a fine"This means to me that DHR is being divided in two, not only to through traffic but to residents too."Yes, although they'll have the same access to the alternative route (via Pleasance Road) as everyone else. What I'm guessing the council is hoping will happen is that the diversion will prove to be too annoying to the rat-runners, and so they'll seek alternative routes (especially once the chaos hits the Google Maps and Waze sat-navs) which will, eventually, mean the alternative is only a slight annoyance for the local residents (a small price to pay for getting rid of the rat-runners).There's no feasible solution for dealing with rat-runners that doesn't affect the local residents. See the barriers at the junction of Erpingham Road and Upper Richmond Road. It didn't let local residents through but the local residents will take that small hit to avoid their road being swamped with through traffic.

John Kettlekey ● 2039d

Good morning John, Thank you for your comments but I must admit, they are as confusing as the whole ETO. I agree that nothing is being physically closed off on Dover House Road. There are just signs on the Putney Heath and URR ends of Dover House Road, no signs on Parkstead Road. But here is where I find your message confusing:  It is just signs (and cameras supposedly) being put up to prevent anything other than buses or cyclists going between Dover House Road and Parkstead Road (or vice versa).  This is a junction, so how can they go between this particular junction????

Buses, emergency vehicles, pedestrians and drivers who want to ignore the signs (and risk a fine) will still be able to drive through that junction either way.  This is really incomprehensible —  why would emergency vehicles be fined?  If there is an emergency on Dover House Road, they are not allowed to go in?  It is a long road to leave the emergency vehicles at the top or bottom of DHR and walk to wherever the emergency is.  ????  This is beyond ridiculous! will the 430 buses be fined too??? how do you fine pedestrians?  Using face recognition? The letter from the Council states that there will be no through access on Dover House Road at its junction with Parkstead Road except for buses and cyclists.  This means to me that DHR is being divided in two, not only to through traffic but to residents too.   So are DHR residents guilty of rat running too?  If this is the case, why not close all side roads and leave Dover House Road open to through traffic?

Ivonne Holliday ● 2039d

"The one and only bus route that runs along it is allowed access (though cannot understand how it will reach either URR or Putney Heath if DHR is being closed off at Parkstead Road), I would assume emergency vehicles will be able to access the whole length of the road and surrounding streets.  Not too sure about trade people trying to repair or refurbish properties along it though."Nothing is being physically closed off on Dover House Road.It is just signs (and cameras supposedly) being put up to prevent anything other than buses or cyclists going between Dover House Road and Parkstead Road (or vice versa).Buses, emergency vehicles, pedestrians and drivers who want to ignore the signs (and risk a fine) will still be able to drive through that junction either way.However, they are physically blocking the access to/from Parkstead Road from the Northern sections of Huntingfield Road and Putney Park Lane though.So it's going to force all rat-running traffic along Pleasance Road, which is probably the intention as Huntingfield Road and Putney Park Lane are effectively single width only, and Pleasance Road will act as a significant restriction (and more so than getting caught behind buses on Dover House Road ever was) and people will slowly be discouraged from cutting through Dover House in order to avoid URR/Putney Hill (which is what a lot of the current traffic is doing).The point of these ETOs is that whilst they are a (hopefully temporary) minor annoyance for those who start/finish their journey in the affected area, in comparison to the much larger effect they have on people rat-running through the area. The negative effect on people living within the area will hopefully only be short lived with a more positive longer term effect as people learn that there's no benefit to rat-running through there.

John Kettlekey ● 2040d