Forum Topic

I didn’t want to vote Labour, but...

Tomorrow I am voting for a hung parliament. I don’t want a lying cheating British Trump in office and I don’t want Momentum. The safest option for this country is a hung parliament. It will provide checks and balances from the insanities of either main party.  And it will give us five years for the three main UK parties to hopefully find the leaders that this country deserves. Since Corbyn came to power I refused to consider voting Labour again, but tomorrow I’m going to vote tactically which in Putney means I will vote for the Labour candidate. But, as I say, the way I see it, it isn’t a vote for Labour - it’s a vote for a hung parliament.

Andrew Thomas ● 2527d42 Comments

the way I see it, it isn’t a vote for Labour - it’s a vote for a hung parliament."I hope that will console you Andrew if we get an anti-Semite for PM and a self-confessed Marxist as Chancellor.

Sue Hammond ● 2527d

As opposed to a serial liar, who has shafted ever person he has ever done a deal with, has almost no humanity and is unfit to be Prime Minister....?

John Cameron ● 2527d

Totally agree... I don't want to vote Labour but feel it's better than voting in the lying bigot who wants us to crash out of the biggest trading bloc in the world and then sell up certain bits of society for his and his mate's profit... Always voted Conservative but can't this time around.

Ben Rainbow ● 2527d

I think many of use share these concerns, and with politics was;t as extreme.What I would say though, at a local level Labour's Fleur Anderson is really, really good, and will carry on the much of the great work that Justine Greening did.

Paul Doorly ● 2527d

Yes, Paul, one has to take the view that one's boting for Fleur who looks like she will be an excellent constituency MP. Anyway, as a hung parliament is a possibility all parties will need to tone down their aspirations. 

Michael Ixer ● 2527d

I would like to say that if I were in a constituency where the LibDem candidate had the best chance of stopping the Tories, then I should vote for the LibDems.

David Ainsworth ● 2527d

@JohnIn a GE do you always vote for the party leader or for the party's policies John? Economically, do you think a Corbyn and McDonnell government would be good for this country?

Sue Hammond ● 2527d

@Michael IxerPersonally, I think all parties toning down their aspirations, and some mature cross-party attempt at resolving the big issues, would be very welcome.England used to be much better than this. What has happened?

Paul Doorly ● 2527d

Sue, I think there is zero chance of a labour majority. But I think there is a very real chance of a conservative majority. And so, I’m voting for a hung parliament. But, mentioned elsewhere here - swapmyvote.uk. - I have, effectively, just voted for the LibDems in Eastbourne.

Andrew Thomas ● 2527d

@Paul - what happened to the UK:Big mouth Farage Panicking CameronMealy mouthed MayCautious CorbynBullying Boris?

Michael Ixer ● 2527d

@MichaelThat sounds about right to me.Putin's somewhere in the background as well, and Zuckerberg (wonder how Nick Clegg's getting on with 'cleaning' up Facebook!).

Paul Doorly ● 2527d

I don't understand why we want a hung parliament though! How is that going to add stability and aid Parliament to stop talking Brexit.  It's just going to drag on anything and given these are important years for my career I don't want to go through any more instability than we have at the moment!

Gabrielle O'Mahoney ● 2527d

@GabrielleI get your frustration at how long this Brexit BS is dragging on for.The reality is, under the Tories it will drag on for AGES, and if we crash out, for years and years.You have a chance to really make a difference and not buy lies because the Cons are telling you what you want to hear and not the truth.The only way, and the quickest way out of this mess, is to put it back to the people with two options: Remain, or Leave (with a specific deal that will not tear the UK apart). We decide. Job done. End of story. We move on.That is the truth. Probably not what you want to hear, but so what?Vote the Cons and it goes on and on.Vote Labour, and it's done within the year.Take it or leave it, you decide.Good luck.

Paul Doorly ● 2527d

A hung parliament could lead to a Government of National Unity (of SNP, LD, Labour, Green, etc) that puts aside all of their party's policies and agrees on a final binding (as much as it can be) deal/remain referendum. A 2nd referendum is part of the manifestos of most of those parties anyway.Democracy in action, or anti-democratic as the hard core Brexiteers will undoubtedly call it.> How is that going to add stability and aid Parliament to stop talking Brexit.This can all be arranged relatively quickly and once that referendum is done the action can be taken and a subsequent General Election with the question of Leave/Remain decided.

Alex Greenbank ● 2527d

@AlexThis multi-faceted coalition that you have proposed entirely ignores the Conservatives. Even if the Tories don't get a working majority in the next parliament there will probably be enough Leave Tory MPs to oppose the Remain group that you speak of. Another divided parliament will just lead to further wrangling and more damaging uncertainty for this country. Do you really want a re-run of the last 3 years?

Sue Hammond ● 2527d

Neo-liberalism happened.Me-me-me, dog-eat-dog"There's no such thing as community"

Philippa Bond ● 2527d

@SueExactly what we don't need. The Cons have had this for three years and look at the state of Brexit and the state of them.Time to get them out of the driving seat and sort this mess out.You got to Vote Labour in Putney as it's the only opposition with a chance.

Paul Doorly ● 2527d

A hung Parliament will not solve Brexit or be a comfy status quo.Corbyn plans a negotiating team drawn from all spectrums of opinion.  Experience in Parliament has shown they will never agree what they want let alone agree a new deal.In the meantime we will have:- another Scottish referendum;- Labour's damaging economic policies (even cheerleaders such as the Spectator don't back the party);- a completely unsuitable leader in Corbyn.In summary chaos!

Robert Wheeler ● 2527d

All rather speculative until Friday 13th. If it's a hung Parliament then that just reflects the divide in the country (52/48)% is pretty marginal given the nearly 30% no voters in the refrendum. I guess there's then the opportunity for a people's vote on remain versus a redefined Brexit deal. As it looks like a Corbyn deal will be a very soft Brexit either remain will be better, or there won't be a lot change - other than we'd lose participation in EU decisions.  If Johnson gets a majority I guess we'll leave but not sure where that leaves Ireland and Scotland. Anyway, Johnson's poor deal probably means several years of deal negotiations; it looks liketghe WTO is being destroyed by Trump so that's a dubioius option and if Trump loses next year the US Democrats won't help; expect a constitutional crisis when NI and Scotland attempt - and succeed(?) - in leaving the UK. In the chaos another election; new government applies to reenter the EU, and agrees to join Schenhgen and Euro as an independent Scotland's already agreed to that - we avoid a hard border between England and Scotland? Who knows!

Michael Ixer ● 2527d

Coalitions (in theory) sound good, but they never work Paul.

Sue Hammond ● 2527d

For a wider and perhaps wiser view than can be got from the Discussion Forum on what has happened to our country, read Philip Pullman’s article:https://www.theguardian.com/cities/commentisfree/2019/dec/11/homelessness-britain-deathNick

Nicholas Evans ● 2527d

Foirgot to add: in hung Parliament, LibDems and SNP support many Corbyn health, social, climate and public services reform but block more radical economic reforms.

Michael Ixer ● 2527d

Exactly, Michael. Scratch the surface of the oven-ready-deal, and this is what you get. Not even mentioning Gibraltar, which is another conundrum wrapped around a mystery. How do you solve that?No wonder Boris refuses to sit down for serious interviews.No wonder he hides in fridges.For God sake, a botched referendum and three years of messing around with these lying clowns. How much longer do we need to carry on with this mess.The Tories are going to win anyway, the last thing we need is a huge tory majority. That will guarantee years and years of this nonsense.

Paul Doorly ● 2527d

Sue, as usual a completely incorrect statement. Do you not remember Winston Churchill and WW2?  Have you not read Boris’s book?Nick

Nicholas Evans ● 2527d

But Ms Hammond if we get Johnson we get a congenital liar; a narcissist; someone with no personal morals and someone who has written his disparaging views on Muslims as well as black people, homosexual men and women who have children out of wedlock (he should know !)All of this puts support for Marxism somewhat in the shade.As for anti-semitism, yes the Labour Party does have poor form on this, but not all Labour MPs or supporters are anti-semites just as not all Conservatives are anti-Muslim though some do have the same views as their leader on this.

John Hawkes ● 2527d

@SueI don't agree Sue, they do require a certain amount of integrity and clarity from both sides, and are often quite delicate. But I think that allows skilled politicians to work in mutually beneficial ways. Sometimes, coalitions are the best, and maybe, only option. It takes a certain kind of political maturity though.At this stage, I am fed-up with the extreme, posturing politicians. Would much prefer some honest focussed attempt to deal with issues in a serious way.

Paul Doorly ● 2527d

A Government of National Unity is not the same as a coalition.A GNU comes together usually to resolve a single issue, that's why other party policies get put to the side. No compromise required on the differing directions on the economy, health, education, etc.Anyway, we'll see what happens come 10pm Thursday (and into Friday).

Alex Greenbank ● 2527d

@Nick 17.11Don't be facetious Nick.🙄 The WW2 coalition was an extraordinary event that succeeded under exceptional circumstances. It worked because the Parties put their political allegiances aside and worked together for the common good. Do you think the Cameron-Clegg coalition worked well?

Sue Hammond ● 2527d

It's our duty to hold the government to account.Now many seem to excuse the government under the pretence that the opposition is not perfect.That's a different argument. We should not let any government think that they can not be held to account ever!

Ed Robinson ● 2527d

Replacing something bad with something worse is a form of masochism surely.

Robert Wheeler ● 2526d

Corbyn, McDonnell, Sturgeon, Abbott - what could possibly go wrong?

Chantal Blake-Milton ● 2526d

When what is asked of the opposition is greater than the government then we know where that leads.I have not seen the PM even subjected to an interview with Andrew Neil never mind being held to account on a long list of items.

Ed Robinson ● 2526d

Chantal, equally bad are Johnson, Javid, Raab and Patel.  I really do not know who would win the race for most unsuited politicians.And this comes from a person who used to vote conservative - not now.

Ivonne Holliday ● 2526d

Hello Nicholas,That is an article and a half!!  Well don Philip Pullman!

Ivonne Holliday ● 2526d

No it's letting those know in government that we expect certain standards or they will be removed.No different to any other employment.

Ed Robinson ● 2526d

Also, the Cons are going to win this, the question is by how much?On a local level, Putney will be much better off with an MP who opposes Brexit, opposes the enlargement of Heathrow, protects the NHS and other vital services.Putney doesn’t deserve a pro Brexit, pro Heathrow extension, pro austerity Tory. There’ll be more than enough of them in Westminster come Friday.

Paul Doorly ● 2526d

Hmmm I wonder Ed if it is no different to any other employment. As far as I am aware, if there are difficulties, the employment is terminated within the law (one month's - three month's - a year's notice)Here we need to wait for 5 years!

Ivonne Holliday ● 2526d

Boris has refused to be interviewed by Andrew Neil. No doubt because  Neil would try to hold him to account.

Lucille Grant ● 2526d

"Replacing something bad with something worse is a form of masochism surely."I wouldn't say that being a member of the EU is so bad that Brexit would be a suitable replacement.

David Ainsworth ● 2526d

Ms Blake Milton'Corbyn, McDonnell, Sturgeon, Abbott - what could possibly go wrong'?Johnson, Johnson, Javid, Johnson, Patel, Johnson, Raab, Johnson, Hancock, Johnson, Gove Johnson...All intellectually feeble, no backbone, no beliefs, self centered and willing to regurgitate Johnsons lies.

John Hawkes ● 2526d

Corbyn is unfit to govern - on many counts.

Stephen Walker ● 2526d

Yes, but I hope you accept what I'm saying: when someone doesnt meet the minimum requirements they get fired.We do not consider their replacement.Their replacement is a different matter.The important thing is that we have set the standards that government must meet!

Ed Robinson ● 2526d