Forum Topic

Hindus and Labour - motion passed at annual conference

Michael - this report on the BBC is quite interesting following on from the WattsApp message to Hindus re Labour I mentioned in a previous thread'There has been much anger from Hindu communities over Labour passing a motion criticising India's actions in Kashmir at its annual conference.It has led to claims the party is "anti-Indian" and "anti-Hindu".Labour has now distanced itself from the conference motion after criticism from a major Hindu charity.'https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50382791It struck me that the Labour Party conference  continues to use it as a platform to voice their (Momentum?)views over other countries whose policies they disagree with (although never dictatorships that they support). Motions are passed which have little or nothing to do with the British public.

Lucille Grant ● 2554d20 Comments

Thanks, Lucille. Useful background. It reminds me of the 1970s quote "one person's freedom fighter is another's terrorist". Of course, if anyone is to blame, it's the British civil servant who drew up the boundaries between India and Pakistan 😟 I have to admit I get concerned when governments start cutting off internet access as happened in Kashmir but then I don't like the traffic filtering applied in states such as China and the middle east and the UK seems to accept that. Still, we can't even get Northern Ireland reconciled with Brexit so best leave Kashmir alone unless the parties want someone to mediate in the same way that George Mitchell was special envoy for NI in order to achieve the GFA?

Michael Ixer ● 2554d

I am reminded of the same quote. I really don't understand how a British political party gets involved with matters in another country which has no bearing on the UK.

Lucille Grant ● 2554d

Michael: I think it is a little unfair to blame Cyril Radcliffe the civil servant who was sent from England to decide the border between India and Pakistan. He had never been to India previously and was given only five weeks to complete the task, given the pressure from the British Government to "get Independence done" as soon as possible - any echoes here? It was an impossible task anyway as the Punjab, through which the border went, had a very mixed population of Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs who up to that point had lived amicably together.The Kashmir situation at the time was somewhat different as, being a Princely State with a Hindu Maharajah and a predominantly Muslim population, the Maharajah had a choice and opted to go with India rather than Pakistan - thus the ensuing conflict.

Caroline Whitehead ● 2554d

Caroline: fair point, I was being a little unfair to put all the blame on him. It does prove how rushing these things without proper consideration and consultancy does cause endless,  and enduring problems. 

Michael Ixer ● 2554d

"Motions are passed which have little or nothing to do with the British public."But the British public includes quite large Indian-origin and also Pakistani-origin communities.

David Ainsworth ● 2553d

"fair point, I was being a little unfair to put all the blame on him."True, it would be grossly unfair to make him responsible, but, one must wonder why an intelligent and experienced man would have taken on such an impossible task. As Caroline Whitehead says "He had never been to India previously and was given only five weeks to complete the task". Indeed, apparently he had never even been east of Paris. "After seeing the mayhem occurring on both sides of the boundary, Radcliffe refused his salary of 40,000 rupees (then 3,000 pounds)". (Wikipedia)

David Ainsworth ● 2553d

And the Hindu community aren't too happy about the Labour Party's view. Fortunately the Party has apologised David.

Lucille Grant ● 2553d

Personally one can't help being alarmed by the increasingly nationalistic flavour of Narendra Modi's Government.

Caroline Whitehead ● 2553d

"Personally one can't help being alarmed by the increasingly nationalistic flavour of Narendra Modi's Government.""The BJP wants to establish a Hindu rashtra in India – a country where Hindus are put first. That is neither democratic nor secular. That is a theocracy like Iran or Pakistan. To claim that opposing the BJP’s actions is anti-Hindu is deeply dangerous and alarming."https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/anti-labour-plot-polarise-hindus-over-kashmir/"On 10 October, the National Council of Hindu Temples (UK) and the Hindu Forum of Britain wrote an absurd letter about Kashmir to Corbyn claiming that Labour had become “anti-Hindu” and accused him of trying to “appease the Pakistani vote bank”, and therefore “becoming direct supporters of Islamist terror organisations such as Al-Qaeda and ISIS”."Sounds familiar? And Labour has retreated and apologised. Sounds familiar?Meanwhile:-Steven Baker, Conservative, Wycombe, 30/10/19:-"Thousands of British people in Wycombe have family and friends on one or both sides of the line of control in Kashmir. With so many serious allegations of human rights abuses being made, do the Government accept that this is not merely some foreign policy issue to be dealt with by others, but that it is an issue of the most immediate and profound concern in Wycombe and in towns across the UK"------------------------"Kashmir has been split between India and Pakistan since 1947 and has sparked two wars and numerous flare-ups between the two nuclear-armed foes, most recently in February when they conducted tit-for-tat air strikes." (Telegraph 31/10/19)

David Ainsworth ● 2553d

Nothing to do with Putney sorry but an interesting piece here from The Scotsman, worth a read.'If one must be the right sort of Jew to elicit sympathy from the Labour leader, one must be the right sort of Muslim to retain his support.''When Corbyn declines to offer support to oppressed Muslims, it is when the oppression is at the hands of a state or movement he considers anti-imperialist.'https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/columnists/general-election-why-jeremy-corbyn-is-no-true-friend-of-muslims-dr-azeem-ibrahim-1-5046056/amp?__twitter_impression=true&fbclid=IwAR2nIoHyb6dKzKjD9rZpiEKdLlMMu9GII8a4stiK3WTr1-ejeK8DedLk6tA

Lucille Grant ● 2553d

Thanks Lucille. An interesting perspective. I think what it does highlight is that many of these issues are multidimensional so there's no simple, binary right or wrong answer? (Hope that's not too analytical: by multidimensional I mean there's religious, political, social, economic, historical factors etc that need consideration. And where do Sikhs and Buddhists fit into theis debate between Muslims and Hindus?) But the more I look at some of these issues the more I'm convinced about my decision to be an atheist.

Michael Ixer ● 2553d

Absolutely - there is no right or wrong answer to these issues. I have been an atheist for a long time Michael.

Lucille Grant ● 2553d

So Corbyn, despite the claims, does not always go after the Muslim vote.

David Ainsworth ● 2553d

He  might go after  them, but  it appears it doesn't mean he always gets them.

Lucille Grant ● 2553d

We worry about religious extremists in the UK, middle east, India, etc and the so called loony in the UK and Europe but what the far right "Christian" fundamentalists are doing in the US looks quite scary ...https://www.patheos.com/blogs/progressivesecularhumanist/2019/11/ohio-law-would-allow-students-to-give-wrong-answers-because-of-religious-belief/As I said on my FB post about this: the Satanists could have some fun with this 🙂 On a more serious note, I'm hoping that no one at the FAA working on the reaccreditation of the 737 Max graduated from Ohio 😟 (Time for a new CSNY song?)

Michael Ixer ● 2553d

What's depressing is that there's even such a thing as a 'Muslim vote' or a 'Hindu vote' (or even a 'Catholic' or a 'Protestant' vote) in a UK general election in 2019, when there are so many other issues of health, education, housing, poverty, equality, etc., to take a position on.

Peter Evans ● 2553d

Well said, Peter

Jane Carter ● 2553d

I wholeheartedly agree with you.  The forthcoming GE is a joke, to name it politely.Religious basis?  Since when!This GE is just on Brexit and all other issues are just loud soundbites with no substance.My goodness, what a charade we are all subjected to!

Ivonne Holliday ● 2553d

Everyone's vote if British born is needed in a democracy so yes  Muslim, Hindu, Sikh and Jewish communities as well as  Christian and atheist all form part of the 'great' British public.

Lucille Grant ● 2553d

Also those that have been nationalised.(By the way British born doesn’t guarantee citizenship. It hasn’t for decades)On a lighter note I still laugh at the “Life in the UK” questions.

Ed Robinson ● 2552d