Forum Topic

May resigns

The Telegraph (and other sources) are reporting that she's resigned, and will go on June 7th. Now wait for the teary drive to the palace.https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/05/24/theresa-may-resigns-brexit-latest-news-european-elections-conservative/

Richard Carter ● 2728d53 Comments

It's been a long time coming. If you think she was bad - heaven help us now. Whoever takes her place will no doubt have to call a General Election at some point and the divide in the UK, that has widened over the past three years, will become an abyss.

Lucille Grant ● 2728d

Hello Boris, bye bye Tory Party.

Freddie Francis ● 2728d

Freddie,I would say he is their best chance.  Personally I would like Steve Baker as he has come across well to me through this,  but to have a reasonable chance against mass defections to the Brexit party Boris could be their unlikely saviour,Who do you think could/ would save the tories?  I think many of those in cabinet do not have the mass appeal and have been damaged by sitting on May’s fence.  Last thing we want is another May who can’t lead, relate to people or even attempt to bother to answer questions They could of course go the other way and go for remain but that would destroy them outside the m25

Mike Warman ● 2728d

You're a bit late with your announcement Richard, it was live on SKY news just after 10 this morning and live streamed on their app, which is where I watched her emotional speech.

Sue Hammond ● 2728d

I'm not so sure, though I hope you're right. According to Yougov, he's the most popular Conservative politician and the 3rd most famous. Fans describe him as: Conservative, Humorous, Intelligent, Charismatic and Clever.How this will translate into votes in a general election is hard to gauge, but Johnson's essential lack of seriousness seems curiously attractive to many: he's a bit of a card, goes a common view. To people who react like this, the fact that he's a lazy, dissembling persistent liar with an interest only in his own advancement, seems neither here nor there.

Richard Carter ● 2728d

@MikeThe more I hear from Steve Baker the more I am drawn to him but I think if the final vote is opened up to the membership his profile isn't strong enough yet to get their vote. I still go for Raab but Boris would win hands down with the voters. He's not terribly popular with his fellow MPs but they will have to weigh up their own predudices against whether they want their party to have the best chance of winning the next GE, and Boris is theTories' safest bet in my opinion.

Sue Hammond ● 2728d

Boris will probably divide the country further: goodbye Scotland and Northern Ireland? Baker, or even Javid, might be more inclusive. (Pity we can't gave Javid as PM to street POTUS Trump?)

Michael Ixer ● 2728d

Don't panic! We're saved, Larry is taking over! 😸https://www.suffolkgazette.com/news/larry-downing-street-cat/

Michael Ixer ● 2728d

Wow, Steve Baker, the man who threw his toys out of the pram because he couldn't get his way over Brexit!His notorious speech (rant, rather) included such classic lines as: "What is our liberty for if not to govern ourselves? Like all of you I have wrestled with my conscience about what to do. I could tear this place [the HoC!] down and bulldoze it into the river. These fools and knaves and cowards are voting on things they don’t even understand."So much for his respect for parliamentary democracy!

Richard Carter ● 2728d

And who would you support to replace May?And who would you think good for the Conservatives?I’m assuming you don’t vote for them, would you prefer a corbyn/ McDonnell Labour Party in power?

Mike Warman ● 2728d

Goodness no - neither Conservative nor Labour deserve to win a General Election. However I do believe Justine has been a good constituency MP so would probably still vote for her.

Lucille Grant ● 2728d

Hi Lucille,It was a question of mr. Carter.  I tend to agree with you though - I think neither deserve to win, but I also think Justine has been a good local mp.This has been a conservative/ labour competition seat, and I would vote almost anything to keep corbyn McDonnell out. I think it would be nice to see the Lib Dem’s do well here and look to supplant a radicalised Labour Party as the main opposition but above that would like to see a move to one type or another of PR to try and move away from our adversarial two party system

Mike Warman ● 2728d

Mike, I'm more into damage limitation here: no Johnson (dishonest, lazy, wholly self-interested). no Raab (the man who didn't know we were an island!), no McVey (another serial liar), not any of the other extreme Brexiteers. Which leaves, of the possibles, Rudd, though in truth I wouldn't even vote for her after her utter failure at the Home Office and the DWP. And yes, for all his faults (under-educated, stubborn, none too bright, hasn't changed his mind in 40 years, his lamentably feeble response on the anti-Semitism issue,and, especially, his Brexiteering and domination by the thoroughly nasty Seumas Milne), I'd reluctantly go for Corbyn, because - despite the silly insistence that he's a hard left extremist - his programme of reform on domestic issues is really what we need (others may disagree).But the real tragedy of the last few years is that we've had the feeblest government and opposition leaders probably ever. With May stumbling at every turn, Labour should be 20% ahead in the polls, but they can barely manage parity. If only we had proper proportional representation instead of our lame and hopelessly inadequate FPTP "system"!

Richard Carter ● 2728d

I follow Larry on twitter and have found he makes a lot more sense than most. Go Larry!

Ruth Pates ● 2728d

I wholeheartedly agree with you Lucille that neither Conservatives nor Labour deserve to win a General Election.  There are no leaders of any worth in any of these parties.Let another party come into power and shake both Conservatives and Labour to the core.  Let them have a respite of 5 years to re-think, re-group and find a proper, honest and efficient way ahead, if they can.

Ivonne Holliday ● 2728d

Ivonne - my main concern is that Farage is able to become king maker in the event of a General Election and his Brexit Party win sufficient seats. Look what's happened with the Conservatives and DUP - an absolute disaster.

Lucille Grant ● 2728d

Oh Richard - you'd go for Corbyn/Milne? Sad that you'd no longer be a 'friend' of mine! You've made the perfect case for not voting Labour. They need a new  leader as much as the Conservatives do - and I'd take Tom Watson over Corbyn any day.Corbyn's 'reform on domestic issues' will take us back to the  awful days of the 1970s. No thanks.

Lucille Grant ● 2728d

I agree (again!) Lucille - tom Watson would be a lot less dangerous!  I would prefer a large grouping under the Lib Dem. banner through eg the changers joining Lib Dem’s and labour right/ Tory left doing likewise maybe.And then, where I do agree with Richard, yes please to PR so that political parties can learn to work together and people can vote for who they would like to represent them rather than tactically in their local circumstances.Finally Richard, that sounds like the monty python Romans’ list despite saying he’s an absolutely abysmal candidate and a Trojan horse for McDonnell who is truly scary you can’t see a better candidate for PM.  I think if his extremism was genuinely popular here then fair enough, I would move abroad while I still can and people could live under a failing socialist experiment but I don’t think apart from a few radicals and misfits his brand of labour has much genuine support in the country

Mike Warman ● 2728d

Richard. Ah, must have missed that Baker episode. OK, better strike him off.

Michael Ixer ● 2728d

OK Lucille. Promise I won't vote Labour while Corbyn is there, though not entirely for the same reasons as you. Hence you can still be my 'friend'. As I think Michael Ixer suggested, would certainly do so if Keir Starmer was leader.

Jane Carter ● 2728d

Jane! I thought I was replying to Richard?! Yes, Keir would be a good replacement, I agree.

Lucille Grant ● 2728d

"Jane! I thought I was replying to Richard?"You were, and perhaps I can make my own response (and remain friends despite that!). Under our failing system we have very narrow choices to make: essentially, between Conservative and Labour, and, although I have no respect at all for Corbyn, the Conservatives have made such a dreadful mess not just of Brexit but in the whole unnecessary and damaging austerity policy (just look at schools, the NHS, housing, transport, the list is endless) are far, far worse. So, although in my dreams I'd go for a rainbow (Green/SNP/Plaid/the decent part of Labour led by Keir Starmer) coalition with Carolyn Lucas as PM that would scrap Brexit and start dealing properly with atmospheric pollution and the climate emergency, it's not going to happen with our system, sadly. Maybe, after a general election, the apparent rise of Farage with his no-policy mob (they're not a party at all but a corporation with no members, only supporters who have no way of democratically influencing policy) will break the system. but the only way I could see that happening would be as a Farage/right wing of the Conservatives coalition, and that would be really scary.The result is we all have to make a choice, and for many of us it's not an easy one: the least bad of the alternatives. But your suggestion that a Corbyn/McDonnell government would take us back to the bad old days of the 1970s is a fantasy: their policies are surprisingly (if you read the right wing media outlets) moderate. Taking back control (didn't I hear that phrase somewhere before?) the railways and public utilities from the crooks - sorry, hedge funds - who currently control most of them has been shown by polls to be popular. But would they have the nerve to scrap the ludicrous nuclear "deterrent"? Or even HS2? I only hope so, but I'm not sure.So let me put the question back to you: which would you choose, the Conservatives (which means Brexit and a hard one at that) or Labour (which might means a soft Brexit or even n one at all)? Except in your dreams (as in mine) you have to choose one. Over to you...

Richard Carter ● 2728d

I can't in all honesty answer this Richard. I will never in my life vote for Corbyn and the Labour Party until they change the racism that lies beneath the veneer. Sorry, but it's very personal to me.I'm not sure I agree that we wouldn't have a hard Brexit if Corbyn was PM - he has always been anti-Europe.  How does he expect to find the money to renationalise the railways etc (although I am inclined to agree with this policy) Borrow even more than we are currently doing or Increase taxation I suppose? It'll be you and me (middle class citizens) who will be affected more than the wealthy who can bury their funds elsewhere or the poor, who rightly he may help out of the austerity measure foisted on them by the Conservatives.I might vote Green I suppose, as a last resort, although I doubt they will win many seats. As I posted before I still believe Justine (even though the Party she represents is beyond redemption now) is a good constituency MP. When in doubt I'd still support her. She's not perfect by any means but who is?The idea of a Farage/Right wing Conservative coalition is scary.

Lucille Grant ● 2728d

Just enjoyed May's resignation speech: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_t25xAp270o&feature=youtu.be Anyone who can watch the end would, to draw on Oscar Wilde, have to have a heart of stone not to burst out laughing.

Richard Carter ● 2728d

Best quote I’ve heard so far - “The dancing queen has met her Waterloo”

Mike Warman ● 2728d

Renationalising the railways is easy; just wait until the current franchises come around for renewal (or fail) then take tghgem back into publiuc ownership. Utilities might be a little more problematic but surely the alternative is to give regulators more power and rigorously enforce them?

Michael Ixer ● 2728d

One question please.I, for one, wish the railways to be brought back to public ownership (as well as water, etc). It is just that it annoys me tremendously that everything is done now for profit but none of these comes back to the railways (or water companies, forget the NHS!!) The question comes with regard to renationalizing the railways.  It is my understanding they are all under contracts meaning they need to be renegotiated at some stage.  If the renegotiation is not accepted - meaning another contract is not signed with that or another company, does the government need to "compensate" the companies, even if the contracts have expired?

Ivonne Holliday ● 2728d

How crass to take the piss out of her misery. I wanted her to go but I got no pleasure from watching her tearful speech.

Sue Hammond ● 2728d

I wasn't surprised by Richard Carter's post because it's par for the course, but I am surprised by yours Mike.

Sue Hammond ● 2728d

Thank you Michael.Your message and my question crossed each other...  :-) :-) :-)

Ivonne Holliday ● 2728d

Richard you are the worst advertisement for Putney.  Karma springs to mind.

Robert Wheeler ● 2728d

Robert, I think there's some competition for  the 'worst advertisement for Putney.'

Lucille Grant ● 2728d

Eh? Something missing there I think.. Like rational argument.

Richard Carter ● 2728d

Why would anyone get enjoyment from another human beings sorrow regardless of what politics you follow?

Robert Wheeler ● 2728d

Well, they didn't invent "Schadenfreude" for no reason.

David Ainsworth ● 2728d

Looking ahead, how do people feel that the new PM of all 65,000,000 of us will be chosen by just 100,000 party members.Should there not be a general election to validate their choice?

Jonathan Callaway ● 2728d

I retained my membership so I'll be one of them. I can see a GE coming in the next 6 months anyway.

Sue Hammond ● 2728d

No it is just a term for someone lacking in human empathy and nothing to be proud of.

Robert Wheeler ● 2728d

The best one I saw on twitter was "It seems like June is the end of May"

Paul Game ● 2728d

Don’t they have a rule about being a member of another party?

Jonathan Callaway ● 2728d

Sue I merely shared as light relief - it made me smile and thought it may others.  I’ve not been a fan since the chequers debacle a year ago when it became apparent she had been plotting behind her cabinet’s back for some time and was not working to deliver a true Brexit.  For me she has been the worst prime minister since I’ve been old enough to be aware of politics.  She seems to have a knack for taking bad decisions (police reductions, Huawei, Heathrow, hs2, a deal with the Eu worse than being in or being out......... - she reminds me of the film with Simon Pegg - how to lose friends and alienate people.

Mike Warman ● 2728d

Richard Curious on a couple of points if you could be kind enough to clarify- I’m surprised not to see the Lib Dem’s on you list may I ask why?- I’m equally surprised to see Plaid and the SNP on your list as both support breaking up the U.K.  as their main policies (vociferously so in the case of the SNP) - are you supportive of this also?CheersMike

Mike Warman ● 2728d

May's speech today was pretty nauseating. Interesting that she boasted about trying to make "the United Kingdom a country that works not just for a privileged few but for everyone:" that was what she said when she got the job, but the truth is that she has done virtually nothing to remove the very many injustices in present-day society.But the most sickening part was when she invoked Sir Nicholas Winton, who saved the lives of hundreds of children by arranging their evacuation from Nazi-occupied Czechoslovakia through the Kindertransport. But whilst at the Home Office and again as Prime Minister, she was mean-minded in utterly failing to react appropriately to the crisis of unaccompanied refugee children and, in particular, to implement properly the Dubs scheme that had promised to resettle 480 of the most vulnerable children from Europe. What a hypocrite, a whited sepulchre!

Richard Carter ● 2728d

Well indeed - the country she loves but if you were the wrong colur you got deported to some other country you'd never even lived in. If you were gay you could get deported to somewhere you's face the death penalty. Fine if you were her colour and a member of her church, her social class and her party. Pretty much like Thatcher really "our people".Embarassing to see someone cry because she couldn't be Prime Minister any more.At least she never got round to burning the justices. That will no doubt fall to her successor.

Paul Longmire ● 2728d

And another thing: she invoked Grenfell, even though it was the policies of Conservative governments that had led to the fire,  and when she visited in the aftermath, she couldn't even bring herself to meet any of the survivors. That was shameful.

Richard Carter ● 2727d

@RCPlease explain how May 'invoked Grenfell".

Sue Hammond ● 2727d

Absolutely disgraceful Richard suggesting that!

Paul Game ● 2727d

My, but the trolls are busy today: disgraceful how, exactly? From her speech, amongst her supposed achievements was this feeble claim :"And it is why I set up the independent inquiry into the tragedy at Grenfell Tower, to search for the truth so nothing like it can ever happen again, and so the people who lost their lives that night are never forgotten."https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/05/24/theresa-mays-resignation-speech-full-prime-minister-breaks-declares/

Richard Carter ● 2727d

Who are these trolls Richard?

Sue Hammond ● 2727d

Back on topic if I may, my feeling is that if the Tories can choose a unifier who is not obviously a proponent of a no deal exit, they might just be able to find a way out of the Brexit nightmare. If they can do, and avoid a GE until after that, then the Farage bubble will burst and just about any Tory leader will see off a Corbyn-led Labour Party. Lots of big ifs there of course!It would be very different if we had PR rather than FPTP but as that works in favour of the big parties it will take a miracle to get any changes through. Turkeys voting for Christmas comes to mind. If I had a vote I’d go for Rory Stewart but he probably won’t make the cut.

Jonathan Callaway ● 2727d

I was surprised by some of the points in Mrs May's speech. Given the government's record on immigration and refugees during her period at the home office and as Prime Minister - vans telling people to go home, the treatment of Windrush BRITISH citizens, etc - and the fact that the Kensington and Chelsea Conservative Council's performance in the way Grenfell was managed pre/post disaster seems questionable - it seemed a little disingenuous to mention Winterton and Grenfell. However, planning to have a fourth go at getting her deal through Parliament does suggest she has lost touch with reality. It's all very well preaching compromise but she's the person who charged into invoking A50 without discussing what Brexit meant with the remain-leave spectrum of interests and the other parties. That to me seems hypocritical: I note she's a vicars daughter, there's good reasons I'm an atheist!

Michael Ixer ● 2727d

Hi Jonathan. I heard Rory Stewart on LBC this morning (yes I know, it's always on!) and he talks a lot of sense but his refusal to put a no-deal option back into any future negotiations with the EU is stupid in my opinion. When I first heard his voice it was like listening to the fashion designer David Emanuel, which is totally irrelevant but the similarity of voice is uncanny.

Sue Hammond ● 2727d

We may have to differ on no deal. It’s a nuclear option where the bomb goes off in our own faces.  It does a lot of damage to us and most of our neighbours especially Ireland and is no basis for starting negotiations on a trade deal with the EU.  My guess is even Boris will shy away from it. More to the point we won’t recover from the damage before the next election and no ruling party will want to go into an election on the back of a wholly avoidable and unnecessary recession.

Jonathan Callaway ● 2727d